The Fresh Loaf

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tropical flops

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pain in the's picture
pain in the

tropical flops

Anybody out there baking in a tropical climate?  My bosch whole wheat bread is sticky and when I put it in the pan it rises in 10 minutes, but manouvering it into the oven it starts to flop and never gets an oven spring.  Any help?  Thanks

librofile

Sean McFarlane's picture
Sean McFarlane

Lower the amounts of yeast in  your recipe and/or you could use long slow fermentation methods(aka the fridge.)

I know my response is short, but i hope it helps.

pain in the's picture
pain in the

thanks I'll try your suggestions

 

 

pain in the's picture
pain in the

My husband likes to add vital wheat gluten and dough enhancer.  Perhaps we should eliminate these?  No matter what we do, even if the rise is fast and furious, by the time we get the dough in the oven, it flops.  We haven't done a second rise very often b/c it seems the yeast expires too soon and we're afraid nothing would be left for a second rise.  One time put the bed in pans to try to hold off the second rise in the refrigerator and it just kept rising at a furious rate and then flopped.  Our house temperature is about 80-85 degrees.  Maybe we should use ice water to mix the dough? Sorry lot's of questions here.  Anybody?

 

AnnaInMD's picture
AnnaInMD

the baking pan as well.  I use a clay baker or the springform. 

 

pain in the's picture
pain in the

Thanks, I tried doing the last rise in the pans and in the refrigerator, but the dough seemed to ignore the cold and just kept developing until I took it out and then placed it in the oven and it fell.  I used a clay baker one time and the flavor was great - did it out on the grill, heating the bottom part and then placing the dough in it and covering it with the lid, but the dough still didn't get any oven spring or rise. 

AnnaInMD's picture
AnnaInMD

exact recipe and the steps you take to get it to the finish line. 

pain in the's picture
pain in the

We grind the whole wheat grain

We put 5 1/2 cups of flour with 5 1/2 cups of 90 degree water in the bosch.

We add 4 tablespoons of instant dry yeast.

We add 4 tablespoons of dough enhancer and 3 tablespoons of vital wheat gluten

Then 2/3 cup of oil and 2/3 cup of honey

Mix all together in the bosch.  Let sit for 3 or 4 minutes.

Then we turn on the bosch machine and add the 2 tbsp. of salt and then slowly add between 7-8 cups of flour until the dough leaves the side of the bowl and there is a break in the dough as it circles on the dough hook. 

When living in El Paso we let it rest  for 20-25 minutes in the bosch bowl, but here in the Rivera Maya, in 12 minutes it is already risen to the top of the bowl.

We take it out and work it into a big loaf on the granite using oily hands to handle the dough, and then divide the dough into 5 loaves. 

We let it rise in El Paso 40 minutes or so in the pans, but here it doesn't rise as much. By 10-15 minutes the dough is already soft and starting to deflate.  We try to quickly place it in the oven but it deflates even more.

I think we should use ice water and less yeast.  What do you think?

A baker here recommended fresh yeast????

PMcCool's picture
PMcCool

1. Cut the yeast back to 1 tablespoon

2. Use cool, rather than warm, water

3. Not knowing what the dough conditioner consists of, I'd suggest leaving it out.  If it is intended to soften the crumb, it might be weakening the dough which could lead to the collapsing you have seen.

The amount of yeast in the recipe is amazing.  Reducing the amount will reduce the speed of the fermentation, allowing you more of a window between "ready" and "too late".  Using cooler water will also slow the fermentation rate.

And, as is frequently mentioned here, watch the dough, not the clock.  When the dough is ready, it's ready, and it doesn't matter what the clock says.

Best of luck.

Paul

AnnaInMD's picture
AnnaInMD

of flour in addition to 200 gr of "starter/levain/biga/preferment".    "Instant" yeast is even more potent.   So I would try to use no more than 2 tablespoons of your instant yeast without any other dough enhancers, wheat gluten, etc.   Perhaps, cut the recipe down into a one-loaf trial and see what happens. 

 Also, weighing the ingredients in grams would give a better understanding of percentages used.  You might have seen in here where building a good dough is based on percentages.  i.e.  no matter the amount of flour, it is always 100% and then go from there.

anna

 

pain in the's picture
pain in the

Thanks for all the thoughtful comments.  Will try and get back to you.