The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

New York City "Oy Bagel"

Dish's picture
Dish

New York City "Oy Bagel"

I was wrestling with the many faces of malt - along with gluten and sourdough - trying to replicate the handrolled bagels of my childhood in NYC. Believe it or not, one of the most helpful things was this piece of vintage film from the Brooklyn Public Library. I'm from Brooklyn and live in Manhattan - there are barely any good bagels left here and few (if any) handrolled. So, out of sheer desperation I made some. They came out well for the first shot. I used sourdough only as a leavener. In the film they use liquid malt in the dough (as shall I in the future). Those old school bagel bakers have some handrolling technique!

Here's the movie "Hot Bagels":

http://youtu.be/p_xTIrT_aiI

Here's the Brooklyn Public Library's Bagel Blog:

http://brooklynology.brooklynpubliclibrary.org/post/2010/11/02/Everything-Bagel.aspx

Here's a couple of pics of my bagels. I used Chinese Maltose in the boiling water - which is like one 10th as cheap as liquid barley malt. It's used for Peking Duck and can be found in Chinatown. Worked perfectly. (I have no idea what it's made from and no brand has any ingredients,  except for one that said "ble" - French for wheat. I wouldn't bet that it was wheat - also there's probably rice syrup in there. I will continue to use it in the bathe. I tried honey, molasses and baking soda in the water - this came out best or at least closest to NY bagels. I also used diastatic malt in the dough. Finally, next time I am going to use malt syrup in the dough, because - as one bagel baker said - the salt ones get hard as a rock in one day (no preservatives). Mine didn't get hard, but they did get stale-ish; they were fine toasted. 





My favorite quote from the movie: "Hot bagels that taste beautifully." We really talk like that.

 

shastaflour's picture
shastaflour

We ran across this YouTube video some time ago, and my kids absolutely love it. Lots to learn from the methods shown, too. I think I'll have to watch and re-watch the bagel rolling portion. But first, have to find some malt syrup! (Well, if we can wait that long.) I know that www.iherb.com carries it, as well as www.vitacost.com.

Thank you for the fun links, and also for including the photos of your beautiful bagels!

LindyD's picture
LindyD

Maybe you've read this article by Ed Levine of The New York Times?  Fun to read.

I've found that the bagel formula found in Hamelman's Bread most accurately reflects the traditional NY bagel.....having munched on quite a few when I lived in the city some years ago.  Flour (high-gluten, of course), water, salt, yeast, and a touch of diastatic malt.  

If you have access to the book, give it a try.  It's a very simple and easy formula: mix, proof for an hour, shape, retard overnight, and bake.  Never disappoints.

Dish's picture
Dish

He's the nicest.

LindyD's picture
LindyD

What type of salt did you use on your bagels, Dish?  

 

Dish's picture
Dish

Coarse French sea salt - not expensive. Baleine. It's in the supermarket. I realize it's not authentic, but kosher salt isn't clear, and I like clear salt (weird huh?). I think I actually did refer to that recipe.

Also, @Lindy I used diastatic malt this time, but I am thinking with sourdough it's not necessary because the sourdough performs the same enzymatic function. Is that correct? None of the old bagel guys I've spoken with used it.  

Elagins's picture
Elagins

Here.

Hamelman and Reinhart's recipes are good; ours is better.

Stan Ginsberg
www.nybakers.com

 

Dish's picture
Dish

As long as it's only high gluten flour, malt barley, yeast, salt and water - I'm good to go. I can't find a recipe online. I'll check the NYPL.

Those in the photo look a little bread-y to me (the steroidal use of yeast is the bane of my existence). They look like most of the bagels in NY look now. These also from the book look a little better (to me).

ITJB bagels

The hydration information is helpful. I went to your site - because I thought you were here in the city. San Diego?  Were you from here originally? I am trying to replicate the Proustian bagel of my Brooklyn childhood; it was my teething ring.

Elagins's picture
Elagins

From Brooklyn -- Bensonhurst, where the bagels were nothing but good. And I can tell you that even made with San Diego water, the ITJB bagels are redolent of Proust, and not the "prust" bread rings that have misappropriated the hallowed name. Even folks out here, who've never had anything but industrial bread rings, rave about my bagels as the real deal.

Stan

PS: "prust" is Yiddish for "coarse, crude, vulgar," which pretty well sums up my opinion of what passes for a bagel these days. SG