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altus = recycled rye

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PiPs's picture
PiPs

altus = recycled rye

What do you do with the fruits of a couple of less than successful attempts at a Dark 100% Rye bread?

Altus!

What is altus you ask?

Old bread …namely, ground up leftover rye bread usually soaked in water.

In my case its old (ugly) dark sour 100% rye bread that is soaked overnight in water. I also crumbled dry altus and fed my rye starter portions of this along with normal rye flour.


Old bread, blended, coffee and soaker

I baked three different breads this weekend, all of them utilising altus. First was the “any grain” sourdough, this time in tins, another dark sour rye and the country bread with two starters.

The night before I prepared soakers, starters, milled and sifted the necessary flours so as to make the morning as peaceful and smooth as possible.

 

Any Grain Sourdough in tins (grains included in total flour)

Formula

Overview

Weight

%

Total dough weight

2164g

 

Total flour

1200g

100%

Total water

960g

80%

Total salt

24g

2%

Prefermented flour

240g

20%

Desired dough temperature 29°C

 

 

 

 

 

Starter build – 12 hrs 23°C

 

 

Starter

50g

20%

Rye flour

200g

83%

Altus

40g

17%

water

240g

100%

 

 

 

Soaker– 12 hrs 23°C

 

 

Wheat kibbled

120g

28%

Barley kibbled

120g

28%

Altus

120g

28%

Linseed

60g

14%

Water

420g

100%

 

 

 

Final dough 29°C

 

 

Starter

480g

88%

Soaker

840g

155%

Rye flour sifted

300g

55%

Bakers flour

240g

45%

Water

300g

55%

Salt

24g

2%

 

Method

  1. Autolyse bakers flour and water for 30min, then stir with wooden spoon for 5 minutes.
  2. Add the rest of the ingredients and mix 5-10mins. I use a scraper in my right hand to pick up and turn the dough and keep my left hand wet enough to avoid excessive sticking.
  3. Allow bulk ferment for 15-30mins.
  4. Shape and roll in rolled oats. Place into greased tins (mine were Pullman) seam side down.
  5. I proved these for one hour and 45 minutes before placing into oven with lids on for 15 minutes at 270°C  then a further hour at 200°C

 

Country bread with two starters

I deviated from the procedure described in a previous posting on these breads in two ways.

The rye starter build was a fed a portion of altus crumbs and the final dough had a 200g altus soaker consisting of equal weights of water and dark rye bread.

The altus soaker was blended with water before adding the flours for the autolyse.

 

I have again tried my hand at a 100% Sour Dark Rye. I had to alter several things for this bake. I am out of rye grains for milling so for this bake I used Four Leaf Millings biodynamic rye meal flour. I also used the altus as a soaker instead of cracked grains.

 

Dark Rye Bread Ver 3

Formula

Overview

Weight

%

Total dough weight

1600g

 

Total flour

865g

100%

Total water

735g

85%

Total salt

15g

1.7%

Prefermented flour

302g

35%

Desired dough temperature 29°C

 

 

 

 

 

Starter build – 12 hrs 23°C

 

 

Starter

50g

16%

Rye meal flour (Four Leaf Milling)

202g

67%

Altus

100g

33%

water

302g

100%

 

 

 

Soaker– 12 hrs 23°C

 

 

Altus

100g

100%

Water

100g

100%

 

 

 

Final dough 29°C

 

 

Starter

602g

129%

Soaker

200g

43%

Rye meal flour (Four Leaf Milling)

465g

100%

Water

335g

72%

Salt

15g

3%

 

Method

  1. Soaker is blended with warm water before the rest of the ingredients are added.
  2. Mix until well combined.
  3. With wet hands shape and place into greased pullman tin.
  4. After my previous cases of overproving I watched the dough like a hawk and it seemed ready after one hour. I docked and placed into a 270°C oven for 15 minutes then a further two hours at 200°C.

__

The altus gave the breads a serious flavour kick and moistness to the crumb. The country bread’s crumb was significantly darker from last weeks bake due to the added altus and it was a delight to see the dark flecks of past rye failures given a new life.

… and again I wait with trepidation for the opportunity to cut the dark rye and peer inside…

cheers, Phil

p.s. A little side story ... My partner managed to create her own version of altus unbeknownst to her when she put a rye crust wrapped in a tea towel through the washing machine. Lets just say with toilet training children in the house a rye crust wasn't the first thing that came to mind when she saw the brown lump amongst the towels.

 

 

 

Comments

codruta's picture
codruta

Impressive showcase of breads, Phil! Your weekly posts became ones of my favorites, here on TFL! It's impressive how quicly you progress, how much information you gather and process from week to week. Your results are better and better. I think you are talented and gifted.

Our journey have a lot of similarities. A week ago, before cutting a rye bread, I was wondering what can I do with it if it's not good. Make an altus? using it how? Fortunatelly the bread was good, so I ate it :) But my question remained in my head, and here you are, giving a good answer.

I have a question: Feeding a regular rye starter with altus, this means you are incorporating a small amount of salt in its feed, too. Is it ok to do this on a long term?

I can't wait to see the crumb of your dark rye...

ps: your lame on a stick looks exactly like my lame (a wilkinson lame on a starbucks stick) :)

have a nice day

codruta

ps update: I understand that there is no dark-rye-bread-waiting-to-be cut anymore? The evidence.. it was washed away?

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks so much Codruta. Rye certainly is a different beast to work with ... I am learning so much everyday.

I don't feed my starter with altus everyday, just on builds for bread when I am after some added flavour. There would be a small amount of salt in the altus but not enough to hinder the starter. If anything it may be beneficial in slowing down enzyme activity....someone else with more experience may chime in on this.

Oh no, the new rye is safe,  it was an old crust from last week that went through the wash :)

I am feeling a little more confident with this dark rye....pretty sure it hasn't lost its roof...but...you never know.

All the best

Phil

thomaschacon's picture
thomaschacon (not verified)

Those are beautiful. I think I'll make the Any Grain (and use it for pastrami on rye or a Reuben) once Mathilda II is up to strength.

What camera are you using? Is it the Canon EOS 350D you mentioned previously. Those photos are very well done/composed.

I want that coffee cup. The tall narrow one. Must have it. Where can I get one? (Sorry for the very random question).

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks. Most of the these are shot using a Canon 550D and  a few with a Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX3. With the amount of baking I had on on the go, I spent a lot less time "composing" and planning shots. Went with the flow and used a tripod a little less than previous.

I love my little coffee mugs :) We picked up a set of six with saucers in a 2nd hand shop while on holidays last year. They are made by a company called "Salt and Pepper" or "S&P"

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

That is so true!  

Exquisite loaves.  Lovely shots!   Do your little folk teeth on rye crusts too?   :)

 

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks Mini. Your previous advice and excellent help with the dark rye was the inspiration for these bakes. Funny you should ask about the kids eating the rye. The older kids are not keen on the dark rye at all, but a slice of the "any grain" with a layer of jam was happily consumed.

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Phil,

I so enjoy your posts and, like Codruta, look forward to your weekend bakes because I know we will all get a peek.  

I love reading about your progression and tweakings of your basic country loaf.  Gives me ideas of my own to work on and the addition of altus makes me stretch in that direction too but I have no left over bread at the moment and would prefer to use a rye bread.....have a rye formula of Karin's/hanseata slated for next week;will see how it turns out....I may get to this sooner than I think!

Currently I am working on 'Day of The Dead' loaves for a friend of my daughter's.  A far cry from rye or a country loaf.

Your photos are stunning as usual.  I love still life pictures and yours totally fit the bill.  Very calming to  gaze upon if one can ignore the mouth watering that accompanies the looking....:-)

Take Care,

Janet

A side note:

My KoMo has started making a disturbing noise....more of a vibration than before when I grind....Panic :-0 as I TOTALLY depend on it and not sure how the company deals with these issues as they are based in Germany and only sell through independents here....I sent them an  email and now will wait to hear from them...probably not until next week since they probably don't work on the weekends....

 I do imagine it won't be a big deal because grains still grind just fine....just a lot of extra noise that I can diminish if I press down lightly on the grain hopper when it is grinding....kinda like a 'spring' might have broken though I know they probably don't use springs in the design.  The stones have a 'springy' give to them and one side seems to 'give' too much....Taking it apart and cleaning nothing provided no clues but at least no visible broken part either.....Have you taken yours apart yet?

 

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

and many have taken the long weekend off so the work week might start on Wednesday.  :(

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks Janet. Glad you like the photos ... I get a buzz posting snippets of the baking days. Sorry to here about your mill. Hope its nothing to serious. I had prompt and excellent service with the head office in Germany when I purchased my mill.  I am still not game enough to take mine apart. Mine is working really well and I can keep it clean very easily.

Yeah, the "Country bread" has quickly become the house bread ... consistently good great! We are also enjoying the rye breads as well. I cut the dark rye this afternoon and it looks not to bad ... the crumb is not quite set enough for a photo, but the kids happily devoured slices of it ... really nice to see. I will try and post a photo of the crumb tomorrow. It tastes fantastic and the crust is SO much better than last weeks attempts.

What is a "Day of the Dead" loaf ... Halloween related?

Cheers, Phil

 

 

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Amazing how kids' taste buds change given time.  My daughter liked IY loaves more than sd but then I began learning how to get a milder flavor with my sd and now she prefers sd...saying IY loaves that she loved before are too bland....It has been about a year of baking with sd...

What is so nice about your Country Bread is that the flours can all be mixed and matched....at least that is what I have found with our favorite Country Loaf.  A relaxing loaf to make as the guess work has just about gone out of it now that I have baked it so many times.

 Day of the Dead - a Nov. 1 and I think Nov. 2 celebration in Mexico. Not related to Halloween here.  " The bread is ceremoniously placed on altars or brought to gravesites as offerings to those who have passed away."  (From: 'Aritsan Breads'  by Eric Kastel)

Loaf went to my daughter's friend and the one here is almost gone....won't make it until Nov. - that is for sure.  

Tomorrow I will see how the company responds and I plan on calling the company I bought it from too.  I don't think it is major - just a louder vibration sound that I can quiet down by pressing lightly on the base of the hamper...I'll let you know what I find out.  I am curious to see how they handle customer inquires AFTER a purchase has been made....

Take Care,

Janet

 

wassisname's picture
wassisname

Three beautiful breads, Phil!  I can just imagine the flavor.  I've had a slow-baked, dark rye on my to-do list for so long it's embarrassing.  Your posts are always a good nudge.  Thanks!

Marcus

nicodvb's picture
nicodvb

Phil! I also like a lot the bread rolled in oats. How did the 100% rye come out? there's no picture of the crumb.

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks,

The dark rye is getting better. I haven't had a chance to get a decent photo of the crumb. Well it kept its roof, butI found the crumb a just a little gummy, which was probably from the starter not developing enough acidity (I rushed it...silly me). It tasted milder and the crust was less harsh.  I am making progress, but I am out of rye flour and grains and won't have a chance to pick up some more for a few weeks. I have noticed you mentioning the rye from the Weston Price website. I have also made that in the past and had the best results for a 100% rye bread. The amount of time and temperature control in the builds is tricky to plan though.

All the best, Phil

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Hi nicodvb,

I grabbed a crumb shot from the remaining end piece of the rye. In the middle of the loaf the crumb was fine, though a little gummy, but at either end I am getting vertical cracking as per this picture...huff.

Getting close....but I am still not happy.

Cheers, Phil

nicodvb's picture
nicodvb

now. Go on, Phil, and you will tame your beast:)

codruta's picture
codruta

Phil, a simple question: how do you "shape and roll in rolled oats"? do you think this can be made with 100 rye dough, too? (maybe rolled in rye).  What I want to know is how do you tranfer the dough in proofing basket (or tin,in your case) after you rolled it in rolled oats - when you pick it up, doesn't lose its shape?

ps. I kept watching this post, hoping you'll put a crumb shot... I read your response to nico's question, 100% rye seems to be moody and tricky, and hard to get it right from the first tries. I'll give it a try soon, but I don't have high expectations.

codruta

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Hi Codruta,

For shaping I use a wet bench to prevent sticking and shape as per a sandwich loaf....so I gently flatten into a rectangle the width of the tin and then roll up. I have a tray with rolled oats and I quickly (this is important ... be quick) roll the dough in them and then place in tin, seam side down.

I think this bread needs the white flour to help lift the large amount of grains in it. I usually prove this in baskets and it flattens out quite a bit when loading in the oven. I think I prefer it in tins...The altus in it made for the best version yet.

Yeah the dark ryes are proving troublesome for me at the moment. I remember going through this learning curve a few years ago when I first started making them...It just has been a while and I am out of practice and not reading the dough and starters very well I guess...shrug.

Cheers, Phil

rossnroller's picture
rossnroller

And I have to say, Phil, that "country bread with two starters" pic is a jawdropper! I keep scrolling back to look at it.

Cheers!
Ross

Jeremy's picture
Jeremy

Made this bread over the weekend, it was hard to shape....feared adding flour on table, so I used a bit of Dan Lepard oil method....nonetheless, this bread was fantastic, almost gone and will make it again and again, deep flavor profile and just spread butter or blue cheese on it your in heaven! Love your breads and blog.

 

Cheers

Jeremy

www.stirthepots.com

PiPs's picture
PiPs

Thanks so much Jeremy,

Thanks for giving it a try ... Yeah, shaping (barely the right word) it can be a bit of a trial ... I use a wet bench and try and work as quick as I can ... but it is so worth it.

Your site, especially the interviews with bakers has been a huge inspiration for me over the years.

All the best, Phil