The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Need a bigger loaf

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ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

Need a bigger loaf

You guys were so amazing helping me with my last post, wondering if you could do it again?

Basically, I just cooked a basic white loaf in a 2lb tin and it turned out fantastic! but it is a little smaller than I had anticipated.

So I am wondering what size tin I would need to create a pretty hefty loaf? (Sort of size you would get from tesco, a split tin loaf type thing)

And also if you could suggest a recipe for a basic white loaf to fill it?
I am using a 500g flour/40g butter/250-300ml water etc recipe. Which is perfect for filling the 2lb tin. With bread, can you just double up on ingrediants? Guessing it isnt that easy. Forgive me, entirely new to baking/cooking of any kind.

Thanks A million guys
Charlie

Patf's picture
Patf

I've never seen a bigger loaf tin than a 2lb one, not in the UK anyway.

But if you want to make a very big loaf of some kind , maybe a boule, you could just use a flat baking tin with a raised edge. But you would have to make the dough very firm otherwise it spreads out -  i.e. as little liquid as possible.

You can certainly just double up ingredients with bread. Trial and error - that's my experience in my early baking days.

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

I have found a 3lb tin on amazon. just not sure how much wider that would be, couldnt find measurements.

pjaj's picture
pjaj

Google Silverwood. They make pans up to 4lb in their V-pan range and are fairly widely available in most cook shops in the UK. See Silverwood bread pans for the full range.

As for yeast, I refer you to your other topic 2lb tin/ recipe help to save repeating myself.

Very crudely, the more yeast, the faster the dough will rise and the warmer the dough the faster it will rise. I'm lucky to have an oven with a proving setting and this will rise my dough with about 0.7% yeast in about 3/4 to 1 hour.

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

thank you for that information! going to look them up right now.

Had lost hope of finding anything above a 3

cranbo's picture
cranbo

I am using a 500g flour/40g butter/250-300ml water etc recipe. Which is perfect for filling the 2lb tin. With bread, can you just double up on ingrediants? 

Yes, you can, especically if you do so by weight, not volume. BTW, 1ml of water weighs 1g, so scaling by weight should be easy. 

Just multiply your weights by 1.25 or 1.5 for a 25% or 50% larger loaf.

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

oh ok, noted. What difference does it make? Just wondering for future reference.

cranbo's picture
cranbo

It's just not as accurate.

When you scoop a cup of flour, its weight will change almost every time: sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less, depending on your scooping technique. Those changes make a difference in a recipe, especially if you're not comfortable adjusting for those variations AND you're scaling up. 

A scale (usually) doesn't lie, and will have very little variation, especially if you keep it calibrated. 

 

 

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

ok, fantastic. Will certainly start doing that from this point on then.

You learn something new everyday in baking dont you. :)

Juergen Krauss's picture
Juergen Krauss

Also, if you have the right amount for your 2lb pan and you want to scale to fit your 3lb pan, you'll get into trouble with volumes.

Have a look at Baker's Percent calculations (on this site), it has lots of benefits.

Juergen

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

noted and looking now. Appreciate the tip.

Thank y0u.

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

Just a quick question. For my mentioned recipe, I am using 2 sachets (7g each) of dried active yeast. Someone has said they think this is too much. My question is, if I were to increase the mix by 25percent would I need to increase the amount of yeast I am using?

cranbo's picture
cranbo

Here's how to calculate how much yeast your using:

  1. Take the total yeast in your recipe (14g)
  2. Divide by the total amount of flour in your recipe (500g)
  3. 14/500 = .028, or 2.8% of your flour weight.

So if you increase your 500g of flour by 25% and use the same amount of yeast, calculate it the same way. 

That said, your yeast may be a bit high in the original recipe. For a plain white bread that doesn't have a lot of sugar or fat, probably 1 to 1.5% of your total flour weight should be plenty. The less yeast, the longer the rise time but likely the better the flavor (there are limitations to that rule of thumb though). 

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

So I work it as 14g being 2.2percent of my flour weight. (with 625g flour)

With one 7g sachet working as 1.2percent of the flour weight. Which should be enough! Assuming my calculation was correct.

One more question, (and believe me, I thank you and everyone else on this site for your endless patience) how much longer will it need to rise with the lower amount? I know you couldnt give an exact time because you dont know how warm my house is etc, but I am working on the logic of halfing the yeast would be double the rise time? Or somewhere close to it.

Juergen Krauss's picture
Juergen Krauss

is highly dependent on temperature.

Giving a time for proofing makes only sense if you give the temperature as well. If you archieve an open crumb with 2.2% instant yeast and 1 hour bulk / 1 hour final I would think your kitchen and dough are on the cool side.

With 0.7% Instant yeast I usually bulk proof between 1.5 and 2 hours at 24C, with 1 hour final proof before baking.

The relation between proofing time and yeast content is a bit more complicated ( I would expect it to be logarithmic )

I would like to encourage you to a little experiment:

Make a batch of your dough as usual (2.2% instant yeast), another batch at 1.1%, and another one at 0.6%.

You could mix a triple batch and then add the yeast just before gluten development (kneading)

This way you have a direct comparison of how the yeast performs, and the taste and consistency of the different versions.

Juergen

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

Juergen, thank you so much for taking the time to reply and help me. I will certainly give that triple batch a try over the weekend when I have a little more spare time, and be sure to let you know how it turns out.

As I mentioned below in a general reply in the thread, going to try my 25% larger batch today with just the one sachet of yeast and see how it works out. Fingers crossed for me!

cranbo's picture
cranbo

I always refer back to Dan DiMuzio's estimates:

This applies to instant yeast in a lean dough, at 77F, for rising times during bulk fermentation:
  • 0.3% - 3-4 hours
  • 0.4 - 0.5% - 1.5 to 2 hours
  • 0.7% - 1 hour
  • 1% - 30 to 45 min
Your dough is not that lean with the butter in there, so it might take a little longer to rise. 
ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

That is incredibly helpful. My mix should come in at just over the 1% mark, so I am working on the hour/hour and a half sort of time frame I think. (My kitchen seems to be a little cool for this sort of thing)

 

Juergen Krauss's picture
Juergen Krauss

not the clock!

That's one of the bread bakers' mantra.

Your dough is ready for shaping when it is well risen, and when you poke it with a wet finger (2 inches in) and the indentation closes only very slowly.

It's a pleasure to help.

Good Luck,

Juergen

BettyR's picture
BettyR

I make all of our bread like my mother and grandmother before me, I bought a loaf pan once and ended up giving it away. It just didn't work very well. Just form your loaf and put it on a sheet pan.

HONEY WHEAT BREAD

Patf's picture
Patf

I've made dough late at night and put it into the 'fridge and it rises overnight. In the morning shape the loaves and leave to rise again.

Or at night shape the loaves and put the tins to rise in the fridge. In the morning allow to return to room temperature then  bake.

Compare the results - another experiment!

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

you guys are amazing.

So much to try! Going to make a batch of the 25% larger dough today with the lower yeast content and see how it goes.
Luckily I purchased a huge bag of flour yesterday so will have enough to test out a few different things over the coming days.

And thanks BettyR, those pictures look amazing! Odd you should mention the loaf tin as I am going to try just shaping by hand today to see how that works out for me. Little worried my dough will just flop but going to look up some things on this site to try and help with that.

 

 

BettyR's picture
BettyR

I was checking my e-mails and just quickly glancing at the thread thinking the subject was about the size of your loaf pan. LOL I have to say I'm a bit embarrassed.

I don't understand all the math and science that goes into making all the beautiful loaves that I see on this site but I still enjoy trying to read it and hoping that maybe one day some of it might leak into my thick skull.

ActiveSparkles's picture
ActiveSparkles

Don't be embarrassed, we have all been (well I know I have) guilty of answering a thread based on its title and missing the actual point.lol

Yes, the math and measurements is a bit of a mystery to me at the moment. But if you struggle with it as well and are still producing loaves like the ones in the pictures you showed, then there is hope yet :)

BettyR's picture
BettyR

making bread... I just make it the way my mom taught me to when I was a kid. I would just like to understand what all the percentages of the different ingredients means and understand how to use this knowledge.

I was taught to make bread by feel, it was a bit of a struggle to learn how to use measurements...I'm still not really good at it.

It is second nature to fill my bread bowl with my liquids and then mix my flour into it to get the right texture of dough, I could do it in my sleep...but as you can imagine it's a bit frustrating when someone asks me for a recipe and I have no clue what to tell them.