The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Jim Lahey's no knead

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troutski's picture
troutski

Jim Lahey's no knead

Just baked my first basic loaf from the book. Aside from being a little scorched on the bottom (Note to self:oven runs hotter than advertized at higher temps...)


This was the simplest and one  if the best loaves for texture that I have made. good thing I held on to that ancient dutch oven of my grandmother's....


 


I can't wait to try it again in sourdough version.


 


Just gloating....


 


Mark


 

patnx2's picture
patnx2

I know the feeling as this was my first intro to my present addiition. Two years latter I bake mostly with  sd. Keep it up. Patrick from Modesto

jyslouey's picture
jyslouey

The best bread I made from his book was the cheese bread.  The only problem was getting the bread into the dutch oven,  I used parchment paper but the dough was rather soft it was somewhat deformed by the creases of the paper.  


Did you prove your bread in room temp or did you put it in the fridge?


Judy

Syd's picture
Syd

Yes, it has a surprisingly good taste for such a little effort.  Baking in a Dutch oven produces a lovely crisp crust that is difficult to attain in a home oven.  It also seems to contribute to oven spring.  Happy to share in your enthusiasm.

troutski's picture
troutski

I proofed for 24hs at room temp then 2 hrs.


I was really surprised by how good the crust comes out. I have another dough proofing now.....


I want to get the oven temp figured out before trying variations. I may put a sheet pan under the dutch Oven to help with the scorching. I haven't baked with an electric oven in 30 years, and I suspect at 475º F the element is on almost constantly.....


Need to defuse the heat source a little more.


 


Thanks for the support.


 


Mark

jyslouey's picture
jyslouey

it must be fairly cool where you are? I'm trying to learn more about room temp and how long to proof for as I come from a hot and humid country and the time taken to proof the dough varies a great deal in different countries. I left my dough to ferment just under 12 hrs @ 30C / 85 - 87F  but am wondering if I should/could proof longer. 

Chuck's picture
Chuck

One very rough rule of thumb I remember hearing somewhere is double the time for every 7F drop in temperature. Of course, you should continue to use the same tests (doubling in volume, the look and feel of the loaf, finger poke test, etc., etc.) rather than doing it by the clock  ...but a guide like this might at least provide a sort of cross-check that you're not about to do something truly crazy.


Provided the loaf is shielded/covered in some way so it doesn't risk drying out, I don't think humidity makes all that much difference in rise/proof times (but I could be wrong:-).


(I suspect most recipe writers mean 68F-72F when they say "room temperature". In an ideal world I'd wish they were a little more inclusive  ...but I can translate well enough.)

hilo_kawika's picture
hilo_kawika

I think that the effect of doubling time on temperature for some chemical reactions is that for every 10 C change the reaction rate halves or doubles depending on whether the temperature increases or decreases.  So the temperature change would need to be closer to 18 F than 7 F.  As always as Chuck mentions following the dough is more important than just assuming the times will be correct.


  aloha,


Dave Hurd, Hilo

Chuck's picture
Chuck

Yep, I'm pretty sure I don't remember the rough rule of thumb exactly. In fact, I strongly suspect the relationship isn't really as simply linear as any such formula might seem to imply.


I am a bit dubious though that in the context of bread we're talking about "yeastie-beasties" not just "chemical reactions".

troutski's picture
troutski

Here's the first sourdough attempt. Other than putting the dough in the DO upside down, not a bad attempt.



 


 


The crumb seems slightly gummy to me. Guisto's unbleached Hi-Protein.


 



Last loaf used KAF Bread flour.


Taste is good, maybe a touch on the sour side. I will make the next attempt with a less sour starter. This one is many years old from the Friends of Carl Griffith


http://carlsfriends.net/source.html


 


Still, encouraging results....


 


Mark

spacey's picture
spacey

If the gummy texture is due to the moisture, I consider that a new world of breads that the Leahey method brings out - it's bread that feels like eating cake, and adds dimensions to breads.  It also helps to keep it from drying out and going stale.  You may also want to avoid high-gluten bread flour.  It may turn out better with plain all-purpose.

troutski's picture
troutski

Hi,


Thanks for the tip on the flour. I have another sour dough dough proofing right now. Bread flour again. I was thinking the last one may have been slightly under baked. I will see how this comes out, and if the issue is still pronounced, I will switch flours.


Appreciate the tips and ideas. This is a great resource!


 


Best,


Mark

bergbarr's picture
bergbarr

My first posy here!  Please post what amount of sourdough starter you used in lieu of the instant yeast. (my starter is rarin' to go!)


 


thanks

spacey's picture
spacey

Everyone's starter is a bit different, but if yours is ready, try about 50g of starter for 500g of flour and about 370-420g of water (and about 12g of salt) for a 8-12 hour rise.  You have to experiment a couple of times, since with an active and acidic culture the loaf may come out flat if you leave it out past a critical point in time: since sourdough can break down the gluten you need to judge the time required from your main fermentation/rise by trial and error.  However, it'll taste good no matter what.  From there, you can experiment with making the dough fit into your schedule.  I like bulk fermenting for 1-5 hours, and then retarding in the fridge for up to a couple of days, with a shorter bulk ferment up-front, similar to the artisan bread in 5 method.  I'll use the same dough for loafs (usually boules, or half spheres these days) and for pizza dough.


Oh, and as you feed and care for the starter, these times may change, as the yeast/bacteria balance may change as you get used to feeding it, too.


 


Good luck!

bergbarr's picture
bergbarr

thx.  I am new to sourdough but am having some success so far.  I meant in this particuliar recipe--where Leahy uses just 1/8 tsp. instant yeast (I realize the long rise mimics the sour dough anyway--how much starter did you use:ie one loaf substitution.


 


thx again.  so glad i came across this site.

spacey's picture
spacey

Sourdough isn't a drop-in replacement for active dry yeast.  As I described, the properties of the dough will be changed for the much worse by trying to maintain a 18+ hour rise if your starter produces a lot of acid.  Baker's yeast, active dry, etc. yeasts are a lot more forgiving when it comes to a long rise. So...


If you're going to use a sourdough starter, in my experience you will have more luck by reducing the time used for the bulk proof.


That said, the real answer is, you can start out with as little as 20g or so, and make sure to mix it with water to start so it distributes all around the dough when it comes together.   However, when you do this you need to watch your dough and see when it looks like it's risen enough.  No-one can tell you exactly how long your starter is going to take to rise the dough.


Good luck.

jyslouey's picture
jyslouey

If I remember correctly, I think I halfed the recipe and used packaged grated parmesan cheese.  Fermented for 11 hrs...


I didn't use sourdough, just the normal IDY.  The crust is not very crisp though.  somewhat chewy...


Judy