The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Malt Syrup making bagels soft ?

  • Pin It
bobku's picture
bobku

Malt Syrup making bagels soft ?

I have been making bagels for  a while now I have been increasing the amount of malt syrup (I love the taste). I 'm adding as much as 3 Tablespoons to the dough as well as in the water but have noticed the last couple of batches have come out too soft. Baking times and temperatures have been the same but seems like crust is more bread like, I just might have to bake them longer and darker . Would to much malt cause this. Also how can I get that bagel shine and still have crisp crust. I like the crust to just crack a little when you squeeze bagels in your hand

LindyD's picture
LindyD

Hi Bobku,


Barley malt syrup adds color and a touch of sweetness.  I never measure the amount added to the water, but go by Hamelman's instruction to add enough to turn the water the color of very dark tea.


It could be you are boiling too long perhaps?  I boil the (retarded) bagels for about 45 second, then immedately immerse them in ice water for a couple minutes, then bake at 500F for about 15-18 minutes.


Are you using high gluten flour?  I've found that makes a major difference in taste and crust.


You said you are adding barley malt to the dough.  Syrup or diastatic malt powder?

bobku's picture
bobku

I use malt syrup, Added to water and to dough mix, about 3 Tbls in each. I boil 1 minute per side no ice water. What is ice water supposed to do? I'm using All Trumps Hi Gluten flour. Do you get a shine on your bagels?

LindyD's picture
LindyD

Yes, my bagels have a nice shine.


The ice water cools the dough and slows down the yeast until they are loaded in the oven.


I think your softness is related to the amount of syrup added to the dough.  Are you reducing the water so your hydration isn't increased by the syrup?  My bagel dough is 58 percent hydration - I add diastatic malt powder when mixing the ingredients.


I've not tried the All Trumps, but hope to.  Using Sir Lancelot for now, but noticed a subtle change in the flavor of the flour with my last purchase.


 

bobku's picture
bobku

I think it might be the malt also. I'm going back to adding less malt and see what happens. Also going to try ice water bath. You don't do anything special to get them to shine? My bagels look great other than that shine I want to get

Janknitz's picture
Janknitz

Michelle of Big Black Dogs swears by adding some barley malt syrup to dough to give it a softer texture.  I'm trying it now for the first time with a honey whole wheat bread which was too dense and chewy on the first go round.  She says as little as 1 tsp of barley malt syrup will help.  I'll have to let you know.


Unlike you, I don't like the taste and smell of barley malt syrup.  It makes me a little queasy for some reason.  So I'm hoping I can't TASTE it in the bread, but I will be happy if it helps the texture.


So, yes, the addition of barley malt syrup in your bagel dough may be the cause of the softening.  Seems to me that it would also add sugars to the dough, and your bagels will brown faster, but not get done as well in the center???  

bobku's picture
bobku

Thanks that sounds like it might be my problem and browning faster might make me take them out before they are really done and crispy like I want. Does anyone have advice for getting that shine

Janknitz's picture
Janknitz

If you don't want to color the surface, try egg white mixed with a little bit of water.  But I usually use 1 yolk beaten with enough water to give the yolk a light, lemon yellow color.  It does color the dough. slightly.  Helps the seeds and stuff to stick, too. 

bobku's picture
bobku

I think egg wash would make dough softe. The color of my bagels are fine just looking to give them a little shine. without making them softer

bobku's picture
bobku

I think egg wash would make dough soft. The color of my bagels are fine just looking to give them a little shine. without making them softer

LindyD's picture
LindyD

Why not try increasing the barley malt syrup in the water boil?


Am egg wash can harden the crust, but it seems like an unnecessary step if you can accomplish the same thing with the water bath.

bobku's picture
bobku

I thought egg wash would soften the crust? I have increased the malt in the water also. I think the additional malt I have been adding to dough has been making crust softer

LindyD's picture
LindyD

From what I've read, applying the egg wash before you bake will result in a harder crust and applying it after the bake softens the crust.


Why not just skip adding malt syrup to the dough?  If you must use some form of malt, try the powder.

bobku's picture
bobku

Think I'lll try egg wash for crispier crust.


I used to use the powder I would end up getting moisture in container and it would get hard as a rock just a lot eaiser using the liquid. Don't want to do without the malt I like flavor it adds to bagels just think I'll use less

thebreadfairy's picture
thebreadfairy

Perhaps you could try using non-diastatic malt powder which would give you the sweetness and flavor but not the diastatic action that causes the softening.