i would say that you need to see a doctor and get re-evaluated and i 'm not trying to be a funny guy

pasta  made from durum and semolina flours have the highest proten and as a result have the highest gluten forming potental of all flours withn the exception of gluten flour its self

while malt syrup has proten but no gluten that i know of

so your problem could be something other than gluten

 also the formula you posted is not understandable and not mixable

whats up with the improper fractions

21 /4 tsp yeast?

Looks more like a grass allergies but needs to be investigated. 

Welcome to the site, Stefan! Guess you'll have to come up with another question.  You've stumped at least two of us but there are hundreds here.   It would be good to know, then you can substitute easily.  Try 1/4 to 1/2 vit C tablet.  Crush and mix into the liquids.  Doesn't Pillsbury AP already contain some malt?  What's written on the package?

Norm,  I think that's 2 1/4 tsp yeast.  A tiny space is needed.    It can be figured out.  It's sort of a math and logic tease.

Mini

 Thanks to Norm and Mini for commenting.

I have been using foods I can eat, and avoiding ones that cause me difficulty; haven't been to a doctor, and don't intend to go.  I may not have made an exact science of investigating what the contents are of what works and what doesn't, but it hasn't really been a problem-except in these bagel experiments.

I have read the ingredients on the Pillsbury flour, and there is barley malt in there, but again-from tables I found on the Internet, it seemed that these kind of flours were low gluten.  Whether they are or not, I don't have any problems using them.

Even so, I'm going to try to go forward from here without making what my allergies are or aren't the topic, and just ask if there is someone who knows what barley malt syrup does in a bagel recipe like mine, and whether there is something else-- some enzyme or conditioner-- that can also do that.

I apologize for presenting my question in a way that was more like a logic puzzle than a real life question.  It's possible that I have not yet arrived at enough knowledge to ask the question correctly.  I guess I'll just keep trying, and see what help I can find.

With Kind Regards,

Stefan

I think if you tried other flours with "tolerable gluten" first (kamut and spelt) that may lower the gluten content of the bagels. You won't get as high a rise but as least there will be some rise without completely redoing the recipe. Otherwise, you'll need to go to the grains that have no gluten (possibly rice, buckwheat, millet, etc.) which you will need more additions to your ingredients than what you have. Also, I've been reading that sourdough could be a choice. There is a growing community on TFL that is dealing with no gluten baking so you could do a search on the website and see what their recipes entail. You'll probably need to invest in a grinder at some point.

The barley malt syrup (because barley has a lot of gluten) can be replaced easily by honey and the malt powder replaced by baking soda.

Other than that it looks like you have to do some experimenting on which flours will give you the best results.

Julia Child has a very good episode with baking bagels that could give you some more information to get as high a rise as possible. Search her website, I think it would be worth it.

Hope that helps some. :)

 Hi,

I very much appreciate the discussion of durum, kamut and spelt, the other grain suggestions, and the gluten development discussion.  And I appreciate the wildflower honey suggestion, the baking powder and baking soda suggestions-and the durum flour suggestion.  I will also explore the Julia Child website.

I have done some research, and I am willing to do more.  I understand that it takes perseverance and patience to have the experiences, identify the questions, and find helpful people-even when the goal is one many other people have already achieved.  My quest is a little out of the ordinary; and so it is understandable that there are a few more obstacles to success.

While I am very grateful for the kind and courteous assistance I found here, these bagel experiments are something I work on once every 2 or 3 months (not a high priority).  So, I think that for now, I will courteously and respectfully close out my account.  Maybe after some time I'll have another visit.

With Kind Regards,

Stefan

Understood.  Good luck with your bagels!