The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Undone Crumb

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blackhorse16a's picture
blackhorse16a

Undone Crumb

I’m having a problem with undone inside with very done crust. I’ve been baking PR’s basic sourdough formula and using dmsnyder’s steaming method. For my last and best effort, I pre-heated for and hour up to 515º (by thermometer), pre steamed, then inserted dough and lowered temp to 450º. I used convection bake. The crust was quite brown at about 30 minutes, but the internal temp was only 165º. I went another 3 min., as more would have totally ruined the crust. Got it up to about 185. My sense is to use an even lower temp. What do you think?

BH

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

I'm a little late, 6 hours ago, sorry.  The best would have been to turn off the convection, cover up the loaf with foil or upsidedown metal bowl and lower the temp to 350°f - 390°F to finish the inside temp.  Another 5 min with the door ajar would crispen it up again.


If you cover your bread in the beginning, you can protect it from the heat and early browning.  Remove cover after about 12-15 minutes, turn down heat and brown the loaf until finished baking.    Another way is to stop using convection.  Most convection ovens tend to preheat faster than an hour, a half hour is usually enough unless you're using a stone.  From normal recipes (without listed convection temps) lower the oven temp by at least 25°F.


The evidence:  Brown crust/raw insides    Indicates the oven heat is too high. 


Go with your senses,


Mini

dghdctr's picture
dghdctr

Baking temperatures listed in books are determined using the author's oven.  They can give you an estimate of what temperature is ideal for you to bake the same thing, but only a few tests on your end will confirm what temperature is appropriate for your oven.  Every baker goes through this process of trial and error, so don't let it discourage you.


When loaves brown too quickly outside, before the center is done, you should lower your baking temperature for that item next time -- by anywhere from 10-25 degrees.  You'll have to guess as you go, and results sometimes won't be optimal.  Just accept that this is part of the process of learning to adapt other people's recipes to your baking equipment.


BTW, if the loaf fails to brown much even though the interior is about 200 degrees, then you might need to increase the bake temp next time.


--Dan DiMuzio

blackhorse16a's picture
blackhorse16a

 and 25º less temp. Iknow I shouldn't change two things, but patience is not my strong suit. I assume I could use convection for pre-heat then turn it off ?? I am using a stone.


 


BH

dghdctr's picture
dghdctr

Just eliminating the convection air currents has the same effect as lowering the temperature by anywhere from 25-50 degrees, depending on your oven's characteristics.


I realize you aren't patient, as you say, but I think you'll be happier with yourself in the end by either eliminating convection or reducing heat -- not doing both at once -- at least not right away.


And while I mean no offense whatsoever, I'd caution you to at least try and develop patience with your bread learning curve.  Not with people, or government, or bad service from anybody -- just with the bread.  You'll learn faster.


Good luck with the next try.


--Dan DiMuzio

blackhorse16a's picture
blackhorse16a

and will take your advice and only change to standard bake, Dan. Seems like there is a whole Zen aspect to this thing.


 


BH

blackhorse16a's picture
blackhorse16a

and the French Bread batards came out very well. I will try the same with the sourdough, but I have a feeling that it will be more of a challenge. I always feels so heavy when it comes out.


 


BH

dghdctr's picture
dghdctr

Sourdough takes longer to ferment after mixing and longer to rise after shaping.  If density (or "heaviness") is your big issue there, you might not be getting enough of a rise before the bread goes in the oven.  Perhaps you're shaping and/or baking it too soon?


Even though sourdough takes longer to process after mixing the dough and (later) shaping the loaves, the dough should still feel noticeably puffy or well-inflated before shaping and later, before baking.  You don't generally get as much volume or "lightness" out of sourdough when compared to dough leavened with commercial yeast, but neither should the loaves be brick-like.


Is your sourdough starter in good shape?  Try searching for discussions here at TFL with comments from dmsnyder, david618, xaipete, lindyd, hansjoakim, steveb, dwink, and sylviah.  They have discussed these things at length and many of your questions could be answered there.  Even better -- you'll probably learn more about what questions to ask.