The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

sticky and hard-to-handle dough

sourdough greg's picture
sourdough greg

sticky and hard-to-handle dough

5 C AP flour


1TB sugar


2 tsp salt


1 tsp yeast


2 TB olive oil


1 3/4 to 2 c water


Made dough the day before. It rose in the refrigerator overnight. Deflated and tried to shape dough, without time to let dough warm to room temperature. Is that the reason why the dough was almost impossible to stretch out without it fighting back? Also, it was darn sticky. Thoughts? I do a fair amount of breadbaking, but am just starting out with pizzas as I just finished my backyard earth oven. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


 


Thanks,


Greg 


 

flournwater's picture
flournwater

My initial calculations regarding the hydration of your dough were inaccurate.  Excuse me for not taking the math to the next stage where the correct answer was hiding.


 

wally's picture
wally

Greg,


When doing bulk fermentation in the refrigerator, you're trying to achieve more flavor (as the sugars develop).  You don't want to degas the dough once out of the refrigerator, but shape and then allow it to warm briefly before baking).  I suspect your dough is reacting as if you've 'mugged it.'


The other alternative would be to pre-shape it, then refrigerate it and bake as soon as your oven comes up to temperature. In either case, I don't see why you are degassing it.


Good luck-


Larry

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

until you can shape it.  You can give it a fold or two. Your warm hands will help.   Give the dough a chance to relax and warm up between folds.  If you have dough for more than one pizza, divide it into pieces so it warms up faster shaping each into a tucked round ball.  Let each rest and rise a bit, then shape for toppings and bake when ready. 


Cold dough it like that and humidity or moisture likes to condense on it.  Give it a very light pat of oil or cover it and let it warm up.  It will take about an hour.


Mini


 

CanuckJim's picture
CanuckJim

Greg,


This is not a direct answer, but it might be a way out.  Because of our climate and the strains of wheat we grow in North America, our flours tend to have fairly high protein content, from around 9% (AP) to 15% (Bagel).  This is just fine for breads in most cases, but it makes for pizza dough that is not extensible and fights back, oil or no, cold or warm, in my experience.  By contrast, Italian Tipo 00 pizzeria flour is blended from many wheats to be extremely extensible (stays where you put it) and very tolerant of high heat baking.  I've used many types, including Divella and KA pizza, but in my experience absolutely nothing beats Molino Caputo Tipo 00 Pizzeria flour in the blue bag.  Once you try it, you'll never go back, silky, easy to shape with practice, great crumb on the cornice, crunchy in the right spots but still moist.  The main North American importer is Orlando Foods in Newark, NJ.  They can likely tell you where a distributor is in your area.


The formula I've used for years (based on one from Molino Caputo in Naples) calls for 65 % hydration, little salt, no oil, scant yeast if it will be retarded in balls.  I'll gladly send it to you by email if you like.  It's a beaut and foolproof.  Always shape only by hand, though, a rolling pin makes for tough crust.


CJ

sourdough greg's picture
sourdough greg

Thanks all,


Larry, I guess I degassed it because I had a huge bag of dough that needed to be subdivided to make 4 pizza "skins". I thought it would be easier to work with, and it would just rise again,or have an oven-spring type rise (again, remember I'm new to this pizza baking, so feel free to correct the errors of my ways).


CJ, I'd love to try your dough recipe. Do you still have my e-mail? And I have a question about your on-line book. The chapter you sent sparked my interest, but could I get an idea of the table of contents, or topics covered?


BTW, the pizzas came out great, and oven-christening party was a big success. My spouse assembled pizzas while I manned the oven, and our friends tended the beer and wine, and admired our handiwork. I think next time we'll have each guest family bring a couple of ingredients, and then pair off people to assemble a pizza of their choice. That would allow us to socialize a little more (I'll solicit a couple of extra oven bakers).  Next time I'll try and include pics.


 


Thanks again, all.


 


Greg 

CanuckJim's picture
CanuckJim

Greg,


Sure, I still have your email.  I'll send off the recipe and the table of contents today.


CJ