The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Bread Texture

MJO's picture
MJO

Bread Texture

Every so often when I make whole wheat loaves, my bready comes out lumpy.  It rises this way and seems to have thin layers that tear into holes.  Anyone have an suggestions as to why this occurs?

xaipete's picture
xaipete

Sounds like it probably isn't kneaded enough. Or, if you are kneading it for a really long time, perhaps you are over kneading it and causing the bran to break up the gluten strands. But I think the case is probably the former.


Tell us more about the recipe.


--Pamela

MJO's picture
MJO

For 3 loaves:                  3/4 cup oil           1 1/2 dough enhancer     


3 cups water                   3t. salt                8-9 cups whole wheat flour


1T. plus 1t. yeast            2T. lecithan


1/2 cup honey                 3/4t. gluten


I start with a sponge, than after I have added all other ingred., I mix in  a Bosch Universal Mixer on #2 speed for 10 minutes.  The dough seems stretchy and nice, rises fine in the bowl.  It's only after I put it into loaves in the pans that there is a problem.  I have been using oil on the breadboard instead of flour.  Could this be the problem?

flournwater's picture
flournwater

I'd have to agree wit Pam on the break of up gluten strands from too much (or too rough) kneading.  But it'd sure help if you could give a picture of the crumb.

xaipete's picture
xaipete

Typo: Sorry, I meant the former. I don't think it is kneaded enough. --Pamela

MJO's picture
MJO

Could 10 minutes on #2 with my Bosch universal be too song?  I'm really discouraged--I'm wondering if I should just start kneading manually.  Although I really want to stay with 100% whole wheat, and making 3 loaves at a time.

davidg618's picture
davidg618

...I'm suspicious of the relatively large amount of oil in your recipe which contains only whole wheat flour and gluten. I don't use gluten, so i can't comment on the amount. However, whole wheat flour doesn't contain much gluten, and oil is called shortening because it shortens gluten strands. That's how one gets flaky pie dough and biscuits.


I'd recommend you try a leaner dough formula--you can probably find many on TFL--or cut back on the oil in yours. We routinely make  a 50% whole-wheat bread that contains 6 cups of flour (1/2 bread flour, 1/2 whole wheat flour) and only 2 Tbs. of oil, in our bread machine that kneads for 18 minutes.


David G

pattycakes's picture
pattycakes

and I would suggest that you try folding in lieu of kneading just to watch the dough develop. There's a lot about it on TFL, and it is a revelation for those of us trying to figure out gluten development.


Have a look at these sites:


http://www.thefreshloaf.com/lessons/tentips_6_fold


Here's one from Mark, and the way he handles dough is masterful:


http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/5763/kneading-and-folding-video


I have made many loaves without any machine kneading at all, simply by folding. Since you have a Bosch, you're going to want to get the hang of it with the machine, but my suggestion is to explore slowly how gluten operates by hand first.


And, I agree with David-too much oil. You might want to start with a half bread flour/half ww mixture, no oil, and move slowly in the direction of 100% WW with a little oil added. I occasionally make a Tassajara-style WW bread and mix it in my KA and I add softened butter at the end of the kneading. Not as good for you, but delicious!


Patricia

MJO's picture
MJO

Thank you for that very interesting info David!  I will try a leaner formula.