The Fresh Loaf

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GWRoss's picture
GWRoss

100% Sourdough German-Style Many Grain Bread

I think this is my first post on TFL. I registered way back in July of 2011. I used to be active on CountryLife.net before Lehman's "rescued" it.

The other day, when I was making a batch of German-Style Many Grain Bread (from Peter Reinhart's "Whole Grain Breads") I did a search online to see if anyone had any comments on the recipe. A couple of the search results were on this site.

On my first try, I closely followed the recipe. Usually, when I have made breads from WGB, I have used the honey option. This time, I used brown sugar, and the result was that the dough was too dry, but I didn't notice it until the very end of the kneading (in my Hobart N50.) I kneaded in more water, but it was either still not enough, or I had over-kneaded the dough, and I was not happy with the final result.

On my second try, I increased the amount of flaxseed (matching the weight of the other seeds) and omitted the yeast, allowing my sourdough to do the heavy lifting. (And of course, I paid more attention to the hydration as I began kneading the dough.)

I was so pleased with the result that I just had to brag. I don't usually roll my loaves in seeds, but this time I did, and it really shows the way the loaf bloomed in the oven.

Hanzosbm's picture
Hanzosbm

Flour or grease to prevent sticking

Hello all,

 

This is a somewhat general question but I wanted to generate some discussion around techniques rather than recipes.  In general, there are two methods to prevent dough from sticking during the proofing process.  One can either grease/oil the dough/container/surface, or one can use flour of some sort. 

Recently, I've been making lighter breads from primarily white flours looking for an open crumb which naturally lends itself to a higher hydration dough, but for this reason, most recipes suggest using the greased method to avoid adding more flour to the equation.  However, I've run into two problems with this.  First, I really like the look of crust that has been floured and looks a bit drier and crustier (is that a word?).  Second, and probably more infuriatingly, I've been having a heck of a time getting these breads into the oven and have ruined a few in the process.  There is nothing more aggravating than spending a week building a sourdough starter, another day creating a poolish, all day kneading and proofing, and then finally, when you're ready to put the bread into the oven, the loaf sticks to the peel and upon trying to get it off, the entire loaf falls onto the floor of your electric oven around the coils.  (and yes, that literally happened to me recently)

So, getting back to the discussion, assuming the identical recipe, how much of a difference do you think there is between flouring and greasing surfaces?  What kinds of effects do you think each will have on the finished product?  Which do you prefer and why?  And does anyone know of a way to prevent greased loaves from sticking to a peel?

a_warming_trend's picture
a_warming_trend

Monday Gift Loaves

These are 76% hydration, 20% levain, 30% whole wheat, with a smidge of pate fermentee for that little added umph. 

No crumb shots, because they were gifts. 

Abe, thanks for inspiring me with your scoring pattern! The boule is exactly your pattern, with a few extra very shallow swirls

Here's to making it through Monday, TFL!

David Esq.'s picture
David Esq.

Tartine Country Rye

Deja vu.  This weekend I decided to make the Tartine Country rye bread again, this time I made four loaves.  The formula in the book:

Leaven  200g

Water    800 g

Whole Rye 170 g

Bread Flour 810 g

Salt 20g.

++

My "modifications" to the formula:

Leaven                      200 g.

All Purpose Flour     500 g

Whole White Wheat 330 g

Whole Rye                170 g

Water                          818 g

Salt                                20g

Because I took the starter out of the fridge on Thursday evening, I was able to feed it 3 times before using it in the levain, and it did nicely by Saturday morning when it was time to mix the dough.  So, no yeast added this go around.

For me, the most interesting thing about this loaf is being able to taste the wheat, the rye and a mild tang of the sourdough.  Usually my bread is not this complexly flavored, or I can't usually taste so many things in each loaf.

I also added a smattering of sesame seeds which I think make the bread all the more delicious.

And a blurry  "bottom shot" since a lot of people seem to burn the loaf.  I avoid that, I think, by nesting the pans after the first 20 minutes, removing the deep top and putting it under the shallow bottom pan.

I really do love this bread.

StuffedBagel's picture
StuffedBagel

Bagel Shop Proofing

Hi,

I have been doing research as part of  potentially opening a bagel business. Being that most shops seem to cold proof overnight after forming the bagels, how do they find storage for the bagels to proof? I presume the larger bagel shops sell well over 1,000 bagels per day. Can someone please enlighten me as to how they find the space or equipment to cold proof (retard) the bagels overnight? I am thinking that some would have to skip the overnight ferment and do a warmer and shorter proof that doesn't require nearly as much storage. Any information would be appreciated. Thank you.

 

-Mike

maojn's picture
maojn

Cotton Cake, so light and pretty and delicious!

For detail steps and pictures, please see http://maobaocun.blogspot.com/ 

 

For 6 inch baking pan

3 large egg yolks+1 whole egg

warm milk 50g

egg white 3x

sugar 70g

cake/pastry flour 60g

butter 40g

 

preheat oven to 170C, line the pan with parchment paper at bottom 

 

- heat butter in water bath to 80C﹐ add flour quickly and mix quickly with egg whisk

- add warm milk in 4-5 times, whisk and make sure it's mixed well each time before add more.

- mix yolks and whole egg, add into batter

- cover and save for later

- beat egg white and sugar until stiff peak, see this video for detail timing to add sugar:

Bosch universal Plus Mixer 攪拌機打發 配件 蛋白打發 Attachment How to Whisk Egg White Correctly









- add 1/3 egg white into yolk batter, mix with egg whisk until no egg white lumps.

- add the rest of egg white and mix with egg whisk until no lumps.

- use scraper to clean the side of the bowl and mix well.

- pour batter into pan from 10 inch height, this will break big bubbles, 

- put the cake pan into a water tray which is bigger than the cake pan, pour the hottest water from the faucet to depth of about 1 inch (about 70-80C)

- use broil (only top heat) setting and sure the surface is colored gold brown, then use bake (bottom heat) 150C for 50min.

 

 

website numbers total

 

Sylviambt's picture
Sylviambt

Exploring stiff sourdough starters

I've been working with liquid sourdough starters for the last several years and have just started investigating stiff starters, something that you can store for longer term. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

Lucy’s 5 Grain Sprouted Practice Sourdough Slash Bags with Scald

When you make baguettes once or twice a year, they can only be considered a way to practice shaping and slashing or as Lucy calls them – Practice Slash Bags.   This version also has 20%  5 whole sprouted grains in the mix consisting of: wheat, emmer, spelt, rye and Kamut in keeping with Lucy’s love of all things sprouted and multigrain when it comes to bread.

 

We also included a 140 F, 30 g baked / scald of sprouted MG flour with a bit of red and white malts as has been Lucy’s recent addiction.  The idea was to increase the flavor, sweetness and the moisture, texture and softness of the crumb.  The water was topped up at the end of the 2 hour bake to make the scald 60 g total before it was added to the autolyse.

 

We usually like to use the lowest protein AP flour available, in the 10 -11% range in keeping with the French traditional flour used but we ran across some AP unbleached flour in Sprouts bins that is supposedly 12% protein and decided to use this flour and see how it worked for baguettes instead.

 

We also like to make baguettes because, with a little wine, cheese and charcuterie, we can transplant ourselves back to any outdoor cafe in Paris for a fine afternoon by the pool - if not actually along the Seine.   As an added bonus, we also get to use our favorite double baggie bamboo form for the long, cold proof in the fridge.

 

The first thing on the list to get done was the sprouting of the whole grains which was started early Tuesday morning by soaking the grains in water for 4 hours before putting them in the sprouter for another 24 hours.  Wednesday morning, we dried the sprouts in the dehydrator at 105 F and ground them in the Nutrimill.

 

Once the whole grains were turned into flour, we used them to feed 6 g of our 6 week retarded rye starter to make the levain over (3) 4 hours stages.  After the total 12 hour levain build we retarded the levain for 24 hours in the fridge.  Thursday morning we started the baked / scald which took 2 hours in the mini oven

 

The only whole grain flour in the dough were the sprouted ones in the baked/ scald which were now completely hydrated at 100%.   Thursday, in the late afternoon,  the autolyse of dough flour, water and baked scald was started and completed in 1 hour.   We sprinkled the Pink Himalayan sea salt on top of the autolyse so we wouldn't forget it.

   

After dinner, once the levain warmed up on the heating pad during the autolyse, we added the levain to the mix.  We did 8 minutes of slap and folds and then 2 more sets at 12 slaps and folds each before 3 sets of stretch and folds from the compass points were done.  All of the gluten development was done on 20 minute intervals and finished in 2 ¼ hours

 

Once finished the dough was rested before being pre-shaped, rested, final shaped, loaded into the cloth and rice floured lined bamboo mold, bagged in a used trsah can liner and immediately placed into the fridge for a 21 hour retard.   

 

Once removed from the fridge the next day, the dough was allowed to warm up for an hour before BO Betsy was fired up for her 550 F preheating.   45 minutes later the Mega Steam went in and, 15 minutes later, the dough was un-molded onto parchment on a peel, slashed and loaded into the bottom stone as the oven heat was reduced to 480 F.

 

After 10 minutes of steam, the Mega Steam was removed and the temperature reduced to 425 F with the convection fan on this time.  10 minutes later the baguettes looked and tested 208 F and considered done.  They were left on the stone, oven off with the door ajar to further crisp the skin.

 

They sprang and bloomed poorly under steam but blistered and browned up nicely once the steam came out.   The ears never formed for some reason.... and that reason was because the dough was over proofed .  21 hours was about 9 hours too long I’m guessing.

 

Since this is the first time we have used sprouted whole grain flour and a baked scald in baguettes, we can’t wait for these to cool so we can taste them.  Expectations of a more healthy, better tasting and aromatic baguette are running  pretty  high…..The crust was thin and crisp and,as time went on, a bit chewy.  The crumb wasn't as open as we would like but 20% whole sprouted grains with a 21 hour cold retard was too much and the the  bread was over proofed.  Still, it is the best tasting SD baguette I have ever had - nothing even close!  I will give up the holes for a fine tasting baguette like this one every time.  Next time we up the sprouted grain to 25% and cut the cold proof to 12 - 14  hours and get it in the oven before the dough over proofs.  Hopefully, the taste will hang around and the holes get a bit larger.  i haven't even put butter on this bread yet - and might not :-)

When puff paste is used for the top of an apple pie the pretty decorated edge disappears in the puff   

 

SD Levain Build

Build 1

Build 2

 Build 3

Total

%

6 Week Retarded Rye Sour Starter

6

0

0

8

2.31%

Whole Sprouted Multi Grain

6

12

24

42

12.14%

Water

6

12

24

42

12.14%

Total

20

24

48

92

26.59%

 

 

 

 

 

 

Levain Totals

 

%

 

 

 

Whole Sprouted Multi Grain

46

13.29%

 

 

 

Water

46

13.29%

 

 

 

Levain Hydration

100.00%

 

 

 

 

Levain % of Total Flour

13.29%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dough Flour

 

%

 

 

 

12 % Protein Winco AP

300

86.71%

 

 

 

Total Dough Flour

300

86.71%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Salt

7

2.02%

 

 

 

Water

195

56.36%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dough Hydration

65.00%

 

 

 

 

Total Flour w/ Starter

346

 

 

 

 

Water

241

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hydration with Starter

69.65%

 

 

 

 

Total Weight

654

 

 

 

 

% Whole Sprouted Grain

20.21%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Scald / Bake is 24g whole multigrain flour and 3g each

 

 

 

of red and white malts and  30 g of water - 60 g total.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multigrain sprouted flour is equal amounts of kamut, spelt, rye, wheat and emmer

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hydration with baked scald is 72%

 

 

 

 

 

Lucy says not to forget the salad 

doddsa's picture
doddsa

overnight proofing sourdough

I proofed a sourdough loaf overnight and baked it this morning, its fantastic! I will do this everytime now

Monica's picture
Monica

Yeast substitute for levan starter

not sure WHERE to post this question, here goes third attempt. Can I use yeast in a recipe that calls for levan starter? I can't keep a starter due to travel, etc. (in the past I've had a starter for years.) I want to use some favorite levan recipes, but use yeast. Any comments?  Monica

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