The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Most bookmarked

Faith in Virginia's picture
Faith in Virginia

Fresh! Hot! Deli Rye just out of the WFO


Well  it's Sunday 12-8-13 and we have freezing rain. My world is cold and covered with ice...except the wood fired oven that is nice and hot.

What a better time to do some baking. Work has been bogging me down so baking was forced on the side lines.  With the onset of winter I should have more time for baking :-)

My bread stores are low so I figured I would bake some of my regulars. This is a Deli Rye bread with  20% preferment.  I got the formula from King Arthur Flour when I took the rye class with Jeffery Hamelman.

I have more bread in the proofer, (4) VT sourdough's  and (6) cheesy breads I like to make.  So more pictures later with some crumb shots.

Happy baking!!!


Nomad Bread's picture
Nomad Bread

A Forum improvement suggestion - Regional section

Hello admin/everybody else

I've got a suggestion to slightly improve the forum experience, and sorry if this has been suggested and shot down before :)

How about a regional section where people from similar areas and backgrounds can share experiences, sources, links, contacts etc? I know this is a mainly US based forum, but since there's no UK equivalent (where I'm based), and the fact that this has grown into such a large and popular forum, why not have somewhere where people from specific regions can share specific regional information that would only benefit them?

You could even split the US into west/east/central/north/south?



pfresh85's picture

Sandwich Bread Wet in Middle

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this, but it seemed like the best fit.

I've been making my own bread for the past two years. I started with a bread machine recipe from a book and then tweaked it a little to my liking. For the most part, it came out just fine from the bread machine. After about a year though, I started disliking the shape of the loaf from the machine (it was very tall but not very wide), and so I began letting the bread machine mix up the dough and then I would fold it, let it rise once more, and then bake it.

The issue I've run into with the last three or four loaves has been that the bread seems to not be done all the way. The crust is browning (sometimes too much for my sons or I's liking) and most of the crumb is coming out fine. It just seems to be at some points near the center (more toward the bottom of the loaf) it is not cooking, as there is still a feeling of almost wet dough there. I am not sure what is causing this part to not cook when the entire rest of the loaf does. I am trying to pin point what might be the cause, so here is the recipe I use and how I've baked it. I apologize in advance that it is not in baker's percentages or anything like that.


10 oz water

1.5 tbs margarine

2 tbs honey

2 cups bread flour

1 cup wheat flour

1 tsp salt

2 tbs non-fat dry milk

2 tbs sugar

1.5 tsp bread machine yeast


I put the ingredients (in that order) into my machine and run it on the dough cycle. After it's done, I take the dough out, roll it on a floured surface, and then fold it and shape it into the loaf. I then put it in the bread pan and let it rise for 45 minutes (until it has basically doubled in size). I heat my oven to 350 degrees, and once the bread is done with its rise, I put it in the oven for about 20-25 minutes (depending on how browned the crust is).


So can anyone see any issues that might be causing the center (toward the bottom) to be not cooking all the way? Is the dough too hydrated? Is the temperature of the oven too low? Am I not cooking it long enough? Any suggestions or help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

searsp's picture

Kmix Hand Mixer - Kneading problem?

Hi everyone I'm a new member so am inevitably about to ask a daft question (I did search first and couldn't see it having been asked previously!) 

I have always baked bread in my Panasonic SD2500 bread-maker - it's a much loved member of the family but I'm keen to learn and have therefore been hand-baking of late. 

I've recently purchased a Kmix Hand Mixer, having been put of by the cost of the Kenwood Chef Class stand mixer that I've been looking at.  The Kmix Hand Mixer comes with dough hooks and am well aware that the max flour it can comfortably cope with is 400g. 

What I've ended up with so far is a stick ball of mess, dough far too wet as it comes together, despite it being used on recipes I've used previously.  In fact, the dough hooks aren't 'flopping' the dough about in the way that my Panasonic bread-maker does, it just gets firmly wedged inside the dough and doesn't do anything by way of stretching the dough out. 

I'm putting the flour in first and adding the water afterwards - is that the wrong way round?
Any hints and tips gratefully received - I have realised after the even that maybe a Hand Mixer may not have been the right purchase given I mostly bake bread rather than cakes, etc. 

Thanks Pete

Foodzeit's picture

37.8°C oder wie ich das Topfbrotfieber bekam – how I got infected with the pot bread fever



Bread baked in the "dutch oven" (?)

A while ago all the food bloggers suddenly started to bake bread in a roasting pot. The baking result was being compared with the bread that is being baked in the Manz oven (semi-professional bread baking oven for the ambitious amateur with humidity function). The bread made in the pot received very good reviews on all sides, but I was sure of myself and my advanced baking skills so I told myself that I am resistant against this phenomena, my crust and my crumb are near to perfection, I don’t need all of this. But that was yesterday.
Tonight I slept badly and most likley some tse-tse fly must have slipped under my moskito net. She must have happily devoured my blood as a great thank you she left me with an infection. When I woke up this morning to pop my retarded bread in the pot, little did I know that about 50 minutes later I will be having the pot bread fever. Even if the bread got a little burnt on the outside (I will put some work on finding the right timing and the temperatures). But anyhow, it already is decided that I will abuse my roaster more often in the future to bake bread in it.
So I am happy and I want to thank Zorra from the blog and Sandra from Snuggs kitchen, who are organizing the bread baking day and who had the great idea to ask for bread that is made in a roaster. Without them I would have not been infected; an infection that I would not miss for anything in the world. Now I am curious who else got infected with the same infection after this BBD.
Here now the recipe of my specially created bread for this bbd. I decided to go with a rye bread mixed with some whole wheat flour, featuring walnuts and some grated Pran Padano cheese, which I left in the fridge overnight for some retarded fermentation in order to intensify the flavors.


Finished bread in the breadbasket
  • Sourdough
  • Rye Flour 153.33 g
  • Water 153.33 g
  • Sourdough starter 15.33 g
Mix everything together to smooth dough without any clumps inside and let it rest in a covered bowl at 24-28°C for 12 – 16 hours (please also compare the timing below). After your sourdough is ready, don't forget to take some starter away and keep it in the fridge for your next bread.

Nut piece  
  • Walnuts 50 g
  • Rum 50 g
Crush the nuts in pieces, add the whole seeds. Roast those pieces / seeds in a pan and the put them in a ceramic bowl. Pour liquid it over the nuts / seeds. Let the nuts / seeds soak for 4 – 16 hours in the water.

Main dough
  • Sourdough 322.00 g
  • Nut piece 100.00 g
  • grated gran padano cheese 50.00 g
  • Rye Flour 357.78 g
  • Whole wheat flour 127.78 g
  • Water 307.78 g
  • Salt 12.78 g
  • Dried yeast 2.46 g 
Start Duration
  • Mixing bread ingredients (not the salt and the sourdough) 0:30 h
  • Mix ingredients + salt + sourdough. First rise (stretch and fold every 40 minutes). 2:00 h – 2:30 h
  • Pre shaping the bread and resting 0:30 h
  • Final shaping the bread + proofing (rise to a double) 1:00 h
  • Pop everything in the fermentation basket and pop it in the fridge for overnight retarding 12:00 h
  • Pre heat the oven and the roasting pot inside at 260 degrees Celsius
  • Pop the bread in the preheated roast, close the lid
  • Lower the temperature every 15 minutes for 10 degrees Celsius
  • After 30 minutes, open the lid of the pot
  • After 20 more minutes of baking, take the bread out and let it cool down
Bread slices cut open with crumb view
trailrunner's picture

Chocolate sourdough enhanced bread

This is the Balthazar's Bakery's chocolate bread. I first ate it in 2007 at $9 a loaf. When I got home I searched and found the recipe online. It is a fantastic bread...but I took it up a huge notch with my starter instead of theirs. Wow..what a shreddable fantastic crumb. I also added dried cherries to 3 of the loaves.  An amazing bread. You will need a mixer to fully realize this dough. It needs 5 min and then 10 min and then about 2 min . It has the butter beaten in like a brioche but there are no eggs...lots of chocolate. Here are some pics...sorry I can't share the fragrance...or taste:) 








starter 100% white with apple yeast water to feed:  photo IMG_6795_zps974c943b.jpg before adding the butter...lovely gluten:  photo IMG_6799_zpsffa15435.jpg after the butter and salt added :  photo IMG_6800_zps9c1ec17c.jpg ready to rise:  photo IMG_6804_zps6951f257.jpg risen:  photo IMG_6805_zps0e52c796.jpg topped with cream/egg yolk/turbinado sugar :  photo IMG_6807_zps083922ca.jpg out of the oven:  photo IMG_6810_zps963debb7.jpg shreddable crumb:  photo IMG_6811_zps191e3543.jpg  photo IMG_6812_zpsb0e323db.jpg

dabrownman's picture

Sinclair’s Bakery Potato Rolls - Made With Poolish

We needed some Hamburger Bun for Friday night’s monthly HB feast and have also wanted to make Mark’s rolls found here:

I’m pretty sure that these aren’t supposed to be HB Buns but they looked close enough to me to give them a try and I’m glad we did.  They turned out great – s good in fact I didn’t even get a crumb shot or a HB picture either,


We were so hungry the burgers so good - they just disappeared.  We cut the recipe by a factor of 6 to get 6 rolls instead if 36 and used a 50 g each flour, water and a pinch for yeast for a 6 hour poolish instead of a straight dough hoping to improve the flavor some. 


The attached formula is the same as Mark’s otherwise and the method the same except for out slap and folds in place of kneading and we baked the rolls in a Pyrex pan instead of on parchment which extended the bake time quite bit.


If we were going to do it again I would up the temperature to 350 F instead of 325 F in baking in Pyrex to bake them faster and improve the browning.  but it is probably better to just bake them on parchment as individual rolls like Mark does.


Regardless, these are some fine tasting rolls and I’m glad there are 3 in the freezer for next month’s Burger Night. Thanks for the recipe and video Mark!  Love your rolling bakery too.



Build 1

Build 2

 Build 3



Pinch of ADY Yeast






























Multigrain Poolish






























Levain % of Total












Dough Flour












Dough Flour


















Milk 25. Potato Water 25






Dough Hydration












Total Flour






Milk 100, Potato Water 25






T. Dough Hydration












Total Weight












Add - Ins





































Hydration w/ Adds59.73%
Total Weight591
CAphyl's picture

White and spelt flour sourdough

I have been experimenting with different flours, different hydration, refrigerated proofing, etc. to see if I can improve my sourdough baking.  This one turned out well, using a three-day method and primarily unbleached white flour and spelt flour.  There is a touch of whole wheat as well.  I liked this try and will continue to try and refine my baking!

jmhp's picture

Different rising times affect baking 2 loaves together?

Hello! I'm new here, and returning to bread baking after many years of absence. What got me back to baking was finding the book "Bread in Half the Time" by Eckhardt and Butts. The method the authors use produces a wonderful loaf of bread in just over an hour.

I have a question, though...I want to bake two loaves at once. To do this using the book's method, one loaf will have to rise/rest  6-7 minutes more than the other. Will the different rising/resting times affect the baking when I put the two loaves in the oven together?

Thank you for any help you can give me!

markf1988's picture

Bertinet "Dough" question

Hi all

Im just starting out and am amazed at all the ideas and spending endless amounts of time on this forum learning

A really basic question is that Im getting confused with yeast quantities

Ive got Bertinets Dough recipe book and he specified an amount of yeast to use (often 10g). Im assuming this is fresh yeast but he doesnt clarify that really

But then Ive read around that if you re not using fresh yeast, the quantity should be adjusted (I use instant yeast so 1/3 should be used instead?)

Ive found that I use instant yeast to the quantities Bertinet has listed for fresh yeast and sometimes my bread comes out with a slightly bitter taste? So Im assuming this is a problem with yeast quantity cos my house is cool and I dont allow it to proof to long.

So question really is... Do I need to adjust yeast quantities in Bertinets Dough as I am using instant rather than fresh!


Thanks all!