The Fresh Loaf

A Community of Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts.

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Evrenbingol's picture
Evrenbingol

Liquid to Stiff Starter.

HI all, I have a regular production levain that we use daily it gets fed 3 times a day , we fork of one at 6am for prodcution to be used with in 3:4 hours at 1:1:1 ration. So it is very healty. 

We also make panettone from itme to time. So I converted my liquid to stuff. But it is way way way to lactic. 

The things I have tired. 

1) flour change 
    a) there was ascorbic acid in the flour so I tried a week of feeding with this flour and a week with an organic flour
    b) I have tried to use a strong flour 13% which did not really triple in 3 hours but around 4 it did. 11 tripled with in 3.30 hours 

2)Lower the hydro to 39% to promote more heterofermentitive starter

3)Have been stroring it 18c also tried 16c

4) Have tried to stored it "bound","in water" and "free". In water is the only one that gave me 3.9 with in 16 hours. Others are around 4 or 4.1 when I am about to start the first refreshment. So I though maybe I get 3.9 is due to water content in my "in water" starter . PH readers tend to read better(even the once for dough reading)

5) Tried different mixing times/gluten dev amount.

Questions

Could Flora in the bakery be making a difference?

Once you starter is more lactic can you really go back by adjusting temp/water?

Having fructose in a newly started starter makes a different(raising water)?

If you want to promote acetic environment for your NEW starter  would you only feed at 16-18c. 

How does oxidation make a difference? 

Tied levito madre said to be anerobic but dont we add air in to the dough when we mix?

More mixing more air ->less mixing less air ? Is that why we use a sheeter to develop the remaining gluten?

When levito madres is sheeted and rolled does  the skin on the dough povieds an anerobic enviroment towards the center of the dough as it is harder for the air to reach ?

Long story short how can I point my starter to a "heterofermentative pathway" :)|
thanks

auspeanut's picture
auspeanut

Brand New Rofco B40 Oven for Sale - SoCal

Brand new, unused Rofco B40 oven for sale. Also included:

 

  • Woven glass mat baking sheet for each shelf
  • Blued-steel baking tray for each shelf
  • 220V/1-Phase/15amp (6-20P) AC plug

While oven was in transit, I decided to slow down our micro bakery production and no longer need a 2nd oven. 

Selling for $3500 and is a firm and final price.

Must pick up in Long Beach, California and have people to help you lift it. 

If interested please email jwaggsbreadbags@gmail.com 

 

Benito's picture
Benito

Lemon Lime Atlantic Beach Pie

We are hosting Alfanso (Alan) and Mrs. Alfanso tonight for dinner for the first time at our apartment here in Fort Lauderdale.  I wanted to bake a nice sunny pie and had this one saved for sometime that I hadn’t made.  I have seen both grapefruit and lemon lime variations of this pie in the past and since I had some limes still decided upon the lemon lime version.  I believe one of the aspects of this pie that make it an Atlantic Beach pie is the choice of crust.  I’ve seen both saltine and Ritz Cracker crusts for these pies and chose the Ritz Cracker version.  My little addition to this is adding the lemon zest to the filling and lime zest to the whipped cream decoration.

Ingredients

 

For the crust

  • 1 1/2 sleeves of saltine crackers (about 6 ounces or 60 crackers)
  • 1/2 cup softened unsalted butter
  • 3 tablespoons sugar

 

Alternate crust using Ritz Crackers

  • 5 ounces round buttery crackers (such as Ritz) (about 40 crackers), crushed.  (Original not enough increased to 175 g)
  • 3 tablespoons granulated sugar 
  • 1 1/2 teaspoons kosher salt 
  • 1/2 cup (4 oz.) unsalted butter, melted

 

 

For the filling

  • 1 (14-ounce) can sweetened condensed milk
  • 4 egg yolks
  • 1/2 cup lemon or lime juice or a mix of the two (I will increase to ¾ cup juice)
  •           I will add zest of a lemon 
  • Fresh whipped cream, for garnish
  • Coarse sea salt, for garnish

 

Directions

Preheat oven to 350°F.

Crush the crackers finely, but not to dust. You can use a food processor or your hands. Add the sugar, then knead in the butter until the crumbs hold together like dough. Press into an 8-inch pie pan. Chill for 15 minutes, then bake for 18 minutes or until the crust is golden brown.  Alternatively, melt butter and add to dry ingredients as per other recipes.

While the crust is cooling (it doesn't need to be cold), beat the egg yolks into the milk, then beat in the citrus juice. It is important to completely combine these ingredients. Pour into the shell and bake for 16 minutes until the filling has set. The pie needs to be completely cold to be sliced. Serve with fresh whipped cream and a sprinkling of sea salt.

Notes:

The crust will slouch a bit in the pan, perhaps freeze it prior to baking.  I took it out and pressed the crust again halfway through baking and again at the end of baking prior to pouring the filling in.

My index of bakes.

Charlie's picture
Charlie

Bread app with baker's percentages calculator and baking journal

Hi 

I recently started baking and found myself resorting to spreadsheets to recalculate ingredients after changing total volume or percentages. I guess I'm not the only one doing that!

I made an app that's easier to use than a spreadsheet. I've made all the loaves in there so I know they work ok, but I haven't thoroughly tested the app and it may have glitches.

Because I find it useful, I thought I'd share it here in case anyone else is helped by it:

https://bread-recipes.glideapp.io

If you do try using it, let me know how it goes.

 

I wrote about what the app does in this article:

https://medium.com/@ukcharlietaylor/bakers-math-calculator-for-bread-making-d4569dbb56eb

 

 

Benito's picture
Benito

Sesame Seed 100% Whole Wheat Sourdough Hokkaido Milk Bread

Although I’ve been baking quite a bit of bread down here in Florida, I hadn’t baked any sandwich bread in some weeks so we were out.  I wanted to use up some of my King Arthur Whole Wheat flour, I had purchased a bag in the fall but haven’t used that much of it yet so decided to make a 100% WW sandwich loaf.  For this bake of my Hokkaido milk bread I have increased the tangzhong to 20% and kept the hydration of it at 200% using milk of course. The rest of the formula was adjusted to keep the hydration and other ingredients the same.  I didn’t use any VWG for this bake and was thinking that the dough would have benefitted from it.  It took 1100 slap and folds to get a reasonable windowpane and one that wasn’t anywhere close to what I usually get at home with my usual flours.  That being said, the loaf looks great to me and I am pleasantly surprised with the KA WW flour.

For one 9x4x4” Pullman pan loaf.

 

Instructions

Levain

Mix the levain ingredients in a jar or pyrex container with space for at least 300% growth. 

Press down with your knuckles or silicone spatula to create a uniform surface and to push out air.

At a temperature of 76-78ºF, it typically takes up to 10-12 hours for this sweet stiff levain to be at peak.  For my starter I typically see 3-3.5 times increase in size at peak.  The levain will smell sweet with only a mild tang.

Tangzhong 

In a sauce pan set on medium heat, stir the milk and whole wheat flour until blended. Then cook for several minutes until well thickened, stirring regularly with a spoon or heat-resistant spatula. Let cool in the pan or, for faster results, in a new bowl.  Theoretically it should reach 65ºC (149ºF) but I don’t find I need to measure the temperature as the tangzhong gelatinizes at this temperature.  You can prepare this the night before and refrigerate it, ensure that it is covered to prevent it from drying out.

 

If you plan on using a stand mixer to mix this dough, set up a Bain Marie and use your stand mixer’s bowl to prepare the tangzhong.

 

Dough

In the bowl of a stand mixer, add the milk (consider holding back 10 g of milk and adding later if this is the first time you’re making this), egg, tangzhong, salt, sugar and levain.  Mix and then break up the levain into many smaller pieces.  Next add the flours.  I like to use my spatula to mix until there aren’t many dry areas.  Allow the flour to hydrate (fermentolyse) for 20-30 minutes.  Mix on low speed and then medium speed until moderate gluten development this may take 5-10 mins.  You may want to scrape the sides of the bowl during the first 5 minutes of mixing.  Next add room temperature butter one pat at a time.  The dough may come apart, be patient, continue to mix until it comes together before adding in more butter.  Once all the butter has been added and incorporated add the mashed potatoes.  Again, knead until well incorporated.  You will want to check gluten development by windowpane during this time and stop mixing when you get a good windowpane.  You should be able to pull a good windowpane, not quite as good as a white flour because the bran will interrupt the windowpane somewhat. 

 

To develop by hand, melt the butter and add it with the wet ingredients.  

 

On the counter, shape the dough into a tight ball, cover in the bowl and ferment for 2 - 3 hours at 82ºF.  There should be some rise visible at this stage.

 

You can next place the dough into the fridge to chill the dough for about 1.5 hours, this makes rolling the dough easier to shape.  Remember, if you do so the final proof will take longer.  Alternatively, you can do a cold retard in the fridge overnight, however, you may find that this increases the tang in your bread.

 

Prepare your pans by greasing them with butter or line with parchment paper.  

 

Lightly oil the top of the dough. Scrape the dough out onto a clean counter top and divide it into four. I like to weigh them to have equal sized lobes. Shape each tightly into a boule, allow to rest 5 mins. Using a rolling pin roll each ball out and then letterfold. Turn 90* and using a rolling pin roll each out to at least 8”. Letterfold again from the sides so you have a long narrow dough. Then using an oiled rolling pin, roll flatter but keeping the dough relatively narrow.  The reason to do this extra letterfold is that the shorter fatter rolls when placed in the pan will not touch the sides of the pan.  This allows the swirled ends to rise during final proof, this is only done for appearance sake and is not necessary.  Next roll each into a tight roll with some tension. Arrange the rolls of dough inside your lined pan alternating the direction of the swirls. This should allow a greater rise during proof and in the oven.

 

Cover and let proof for  4-6 hours at a warm temperature.  I proof at 82°F.  You will need longer than 4-6 hours if you chilled your dough for shaping. I proof until the top of the dough comes to within 1 cm of the top edge of the pan.

 

Preheat the oven to 350F and brush the dough with the egg-milk wash.  Just prior to baking brush with the egg-milk wash again.  Sprinkle sesame seeds on the top of the dough.

 

Bake the loaves for 50 minutes or until the internal temperature is at least 190ºF, rotating as needed to get even browning. Shield your loaf if it gets brown early in the baking process. After 50 mins remove the bread from the pan and bake a further 10 mins by placing the loaf directly in the oven on the rack with the oven turned down to 325ºF.

My index of bakes.

CalBeachBaker's picture
CalBeachBaker

GOST Borodinsky - Borodinskiy Chelb GOST (Russia)

Today's bake: GOST Borodinsky -  Borodinskiy Chelb GOST (Russia)

Source: The Rye Baker by Stanley Ginsberg

Note: Changed TDW from 1.591kg to 2.784kg, replaced dark molasses for blackstrap molasses due to availability.

Discussion:

Another recipe from The Rye Baker. I've been wanting to make this bread for some time and now that I've gotten a fresh supply of rye berries, sprouted/dried/roasted some rye berries for the red malt, it was time to bake. This is my 1st attempt making this bread  and I am pleased with the results and the taste. This will go definitely go on the 'make again' list.

Changes/Recommendations: None

Tasting Notes

Crumb: Sour/Dairy - Buttermilk

Crust: Toasty - Malty

Grain Character: Complex - Cooked Whole Grains

Description:

This bread fermented quite assertively and I had to abandon the pan lid and use foil to cover it during the second segment of the bake. It baked nicely and the crumb was firm and had nice molasses taste and citrus notes of the coriander seeds. What I am enjoying is the mouthwatering tang of the rye sourdough so pronounced in this bread.

This is a really nice medium density bread that would go well with most rich foods. It is excellent with goat cheese.

Recipe and Process are below for those that are interested.

 

 

 

 

 

The Roadside Pie King's picture
The Roadside Pi...

The real deal. old school, New York water bagels

I cracked the code! No, it's not the water! That being said, what is the secret to achieving a true N.Y. water bagel anywhere in the civilized world? The trick is, to treat your high-gluten, low-hydration dough with care from the get-go. Let me elaborate, while normal to high-hydration dough can tolerate sitting on the bench uncovered, Ultra low hydration bagel dough cannot. Once the dough begins to lose moisture to the air, it is game over. While these observations are anecdotal and have not passed peer review. I am confident that a well-treated bagel dough will pay dividends your taste buds will thank you.  

 

 

bagel dough 

albacore's picture
albacore

Trip to Naples

I'm off to Naples, Italy for a few days at the end of the month. Can anyone recommend any bakeries, pizzerias or restaurants worth a visit?

Lance

mcs's picture
mcs

This one's for you, Eric (ehanner)

Back in the day, many twists and turns ago, there was a member of this forum who was quite generous with his time and knowledge. His name was Eric, aka ehanner. 

Some of us knew him personally as a friend and communicated with him through this forum, emails and phone calls.  

During that time period, the most popular post on this forum was his own, in which he shared his recipe for a Jewish/deli rye, known as "Eric's favorite rye". I think everyone active on this forum tried it at least once.

He and I spoke about it and as all bakers do, I made a few minor changes to suit my style and equipment and to make the recipe my own. 

It was at that time in 2008 that I started my own bakery, to which I added the rye to my menu.  It became very popular with those who were nostalgic for bread they had had long ago, and also quite popular with people who had never had 'a good rye'.

A few years later as a result of many life changes, I decided to close the bakery and begin a new one in another part of the Montana. This time, it was going to be a mobile bakery that I designed myself. Unique and challenging in every way, I was quite nervous about this gigantic leap that I was about to make, seeing as a mobile bakery of this sort existed nowhere else in the world. There were so many questions about timing, workflow and production, not to mention the actual baking, that had never been answered.

Eric called me one day, right before I left on this journey to encourage me with words I'll never forget, "Mark. This new bakery of yours will succeed beyond your wildest dreams. It will be better than The Back Home Bakery ever was. If anyone can do it, you can."

And just like that, two days later, Eric passed away.

That was it.

I began my new life with his words in my head, and they are still here. He was right.

He was a great man, and this is his Rye.

-Mark

 

 

Benito's picture
Benito

Lime Coconut Pie

We are still enjoying the Florida warmth down here in Fort Lauderdale.  Since we arrived there has been rain only one day and there might have been one cloudy day at most.  It has been sunny days after sunny days, I’m not complaining.

We had a dinner party last night with a few of our Canadian friends so needed bread and a dessert.  I’ll post the bread I made in a separate blog post.  One of our favourite desserts to have here is Key Lime Pie.  Years ago when we were in Key West we went to the bakery that supposedly had the best Key Lime Pie in Florida, the Blonde Giraffe.  This was long before I started to bake.  So I decided to bake something I think turned out as well if not better, a lime coconut pie with a Graham cracker crust.

I prefer this version with its subtle coconut flavour.  If you love coconut, I would change the whipped cream on top to whipped coconut cream.  The finish of the lime zest really gives it the lovely lime scent when you serve the pie and it looks nice as well.

The Graham cracker crust is from Sally’s baking website.  I’ve made a note that I find graham cracker crusts to be a bit too sweet so I’d try reducing the sugar in the future.  I’m not sure if I can eliminate it completely as I believe she says that it is needed to help bind the crumbs together.  I would think that the melted butter does most of that though.

Ingredients - 1 graham cracker crust

  • 1 and 1/2 cups (180g) graham cracker crumbs (about 12 full sheet graham crackers)
  • 1/4 cup (50g) granulated sugar (try reducing as this is quite sweet, not sure if can eliminate completely so try using only 20-25g)
  • 6 Tablespoons (85g) unsalted butter, melted

 

Instructions

  1. If you’re starting out with full graham crackers, use a food processor or blender to grind them into fine crumbs. You can also place them in a zip-top bag and crush them into fine crumbs with a little arm muscle and a rolling pin.
  2. Stir the graham cracker crumbs and granulated sugar together in a medium bowl, and then stir in the melted butter. The mixture will be thick, coarse, and sandy. Try to smash/break up any large chunks.
  3. Pour the mixture into an ungreased 8-inch, 9-inch, or 10-inch pie dish, cake pan, springform pan, or square pan. With medium pressure using your hand, pat the crumbs down into the bottom and up the sides to make a compact crust. Do not pack down with heavy force because that makes the crust too hard. Simply pat down until the mixture is no longer crumby/crumbly. Tip:You can use a small flat-bottomed measuring cup to help press down the bottom crust and smooth out the surface, but do not pack down too hard. If making a pie, run a spoon around the bottom “corner” where the edge and bottom meet to help make a rounded crust⁠—this helps prevent the crust from falling apart when you cut slices.
  4. For a baked dessert, pre-bake this crust per your filling recipe’s directions. I usually pre-bake for 10 minutes at 350°F (177°C). For a no-bake dessert, cool the crust completely before using, unless your filling’s recipe instructs otherwise.

Lime coconut filling 

Ingredients:

  • 250 ml (1 cup) heavy cream
  • 4 tablespoons icing sugar (sub 2 tbsp sugar)
  • 5-ounces (1 can) unsweetened coconut milk
  • 14-ounces (1 can) sweetened condensed milk
  • 1/4 cup freshly squeezed or bottled Key lime juice
  • Zest of 1 lime, finely grated

To garnish:

  • Whipped cream (optional)
  • Toasted coconut (optional)
  • lime slices (optional)

 

Instructions:

 

  • In a bowl, using an electric mixer beat heavy cream and sugar until creamy. Add the coconut milk, condensed milk, lime juice, and lime zest and whisk until fluffy and thick. Pour into crust and refrigerate for at least 30 minutes to set.
  • Before serving, top pie with whipped cream, sprinkle some toasted coconut and/or lime slices (if desired). Slice and serve.

 

My index of bakes.

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