The Fresh Loaf

A Community of Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts.

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colinwhipple's picture

Parchment Paper - Temperature Limit?

I bought a roll of Wilton parchment paper. The packaging says the temperature limit is 400 degrees.

Some of the recipes I want to use it with call for temps up to 500 degrees. Can the parchment paper still be used? What can the adverse consequences be?




Paddyscake's picture

Trouble with baking 2 loaves..

I finally made Thom Leonard's French Country bread. Great flavor, crumb was OK..I had a ? about how to shape a "tight boule, without deflating", but I'll work that out. My problem is that whenever I bake 2 loaves I don't have the room to fit them both on the stone at the same time. The first one has a great crust, spring and color. The 2nd one looks anemic. I reheat the oven to 500, refill my pan of water with 1/4" of hot water, the vent has steam pouring out and voila..blah. I'm just wondering what the difference is..the stone has been in the oven for the preheat and bake of the 1st loaf, I bring the temp back up , re-establish the steam..any ideas? This happens any time I bake 2 loaves one at a time.

Bakersdozen's picture

Dinner Rolls

Hi All:

Does anyone have a good receipe for Dinner Rolls.  I'm going to a dinner on the 4th and said I would bring the dinner rolls.  Then I stoped and thought I don't have a receipe for dinner rolls.  Any help would be appreciated.


danmerk's picture

Marble Rye - help me with this recipe

Can someone help me create a marble rye recipe? I am looking for a lighter crumb than my normal sourdough as this will be a few loaves for friends. Here is what I was planning on doing.

Use a refreshed starter and build to 200g (used to split for seperate levains)

Rye Bread

400g white flour
200g rye flour
16g salt
400g water


400g white flour
200g rye flour
16g salt
100g molasses
5g cocoa powder
375g water

Mix seperatly, autoyse, and then knead in 100g of starter to each. Let ferment for 2 hours turning 2-3 times. Shape into balls, let rest. Roll each slightly to flatten, placing one on top of the other and rolling for marbling effect. Let proof until ready. Bake 350 in cold oven. Egg wash.

Floydm's picture

A baking day in pictures

Sunday I finally got a real baking day in. It was the first time in... 2 months? 3 months? A very long time.

I started with the Sourdough English Muffin recipe that Kjknits posted a month or so ago.

They were *amazing*. There wasn't a terribly interesting smell or anything, but when I bit into one it was just one of those "Oh, wow" moments. I will definitely be baking them again.

Pretty nice crumb inside.

I don't have cutter or tins, I just used a mason jar lid. The ones I was happiest with I left about 1/3 inch tall when cutting and then squashed a bit wider and thinner before cooking.

I also make something like a cross between my standard pain sur poolish and the famous no knead bread.

The hydration on this was quite high, probably in the 70-75% range. It spread a little more than I would have liked, but the crumb was very nice (though slightly underbaked). Particularly nice since I'd run out of bread flour and was just baking with store brand AP flour.

I also made three sourdough loaves...

...and experimented a little with the scoring.

I thought it looked like a yin-yang, but my wife says it looks more like the Safeway Logo.

zolablue's picture

Fendu shaping help

I would like some information and help on shaping fendu loaves.  I found only two entries on this site as follows:


Floyd’s beautiful fendu loaf:


JMonkey’s also beautiful rendition of a fendu loaf:


I have made the Hamelman, Roasted Potato Bread, and it is delicious!  I was very disappointed as well to find Hamelman (as with many other things in his book supposedly for the home baker) does not provide good instructions for this and unfortunately both my loaves stuck together.  I would like to know how these were accomplished, if you guys see this, or if anyone else can offer some expertise.


I tried it again with another dough recipe and it also stuck together despite my trying to sprinkle extra flour in the crease before proofing.  I love this shape and it would lend itself well to many other breads so I would like to learn to master it. 

meedo's picture

Ataif bil ashta

This recipe from the Middle East, we eat it especially in Ramadan or any time of the year, cause it's so tasty.


For the dough:

2 cups all purpose flour

1/4 cup whole wheat flour

1 1/2 teaspoon yeast

1 1/2 teaspoon sugar

1 1/2 cup fat free milk

1 1/2 cup water


For the filling (ashta):

2 cups fat free milk

7 1/2 tablespoons corn starch

1/4 cup + 1 tablespoon sugar

2 to 3 tablespoons thick cream (qaimar which is an Iraqi cream) but you can use the regular thick cream 

2 tablespoons rose water

1 teaspoon vanilla


Chopped pistachio


To make the dough:

1-Mix the entire ingredient and let it rest about 40 minutes.

2- Cook about 2 tablespoon of the dough mixture in a hot pan until it bubble (just cook one side).

After finishing let them cool then fold half round then fill them with the filling (Using pastry bag) then dip them in the chopped pistachios.

To make the filling:

Mix corn starch with milk and sugar then bring it to boil in a medium pan, stir until thickens, then add the rest of the ingredient.

Spoon mixture into a bowel, refrigerate until cold.

Pastry bag:


Qaimar (Iraqi cream):

Serve with honey or syrup:

Visit my blog:


rebecca77's picture

summer baking

Hi. I've been lurking for a month or so (and baking for about a year)--what a wonderful community!  I'm excited that I'm going to have significant time this summer to spend baking, and I was wondering if any of you had some advice.  My apartment doesn't have air conditioning, so it is often upwards of 85 F.  I don't mind baking in the heat, but I’d like to figure out how to compensate for such warm ambient conditions. In particular, I was wondering about the best ways to mimic slow "room temperature" rises. Also, is it possible/desirable to cool the dough down before kneading? While I know books say to knead dough until about 77-81 F, my dough is starting out significantly warmer than this even before any kneading.  Thanks!  

Rosalie's picture

Laurel's Kitchen Bread Book comments on cold oven baking

I decided to give serious study to my good bread books, and Laurel's floated to the top.

My favored place for proofing is in my gas oven, which I turn on until it just barely registers a temperature rise; then I turn on the oven light, and it maintains a temperature of 80-90 degrees.  Of course, I don't do this when I want a slow rise, but my kitchen is typically 60-65 degrees, so this is great for the final rise or when I'm in a hurry.

On page 408 (1984 edition; I think it's the same in the revised edition), she addresses this issue:  "Halfway through the final rise, the time comes when you have to preheat the oven.  The bread's inside:  what to do?"   She then lists four options, the first of which is, "Set the nearly risen loaves in a draft-free place, turn on the oven, and don't worry about it."  That's what I do.  The second option is to float the loaf pans in a dishpan of warm water (covered, of course); the fourth utilizes a heating pad or a hot-water bottle.

But the third option caught my attention.  People have talked quite a bit about baking in an un-preheated oven.  I baked a bread once that specified cold oven - I think it was called Cuban Bread.  Laurel (and her friends) say that you can leave the loaves in place and turn on the oven when the loaves are about three-quarters risen (depending on how long your oven takes to heat up - sooner if your oven heats slowly).  She calls this "a daredevil technique" that won't work for breads that require a higher initial temperature for oven rise.  She adds that it works better for recipes that include milk or a lot of sweetener.  (And she cautions you to remove plastic and other materials that don't do well in a hot oven.  I've long since learned to look in the oven before turning it on.)

How does this jive with all you breadbakers' experience?


browndog's picture

flour show

My cousin's well-tended garden boasts the company of a clump of chives descended from our great-uncle's plants of about a hundred years ago. My garden is simpler and consists of what grows by inclination in the fields and forests near my home. Much of what I find was not here when Europeans arrived- New England was arboreal then, and the man-made grasslands are eternally trying to revert. Of the flowers in my vases only the common fleabane and a bit of madder are native.vsd

My starter was not begged from the ether like so many of yours, but given to me by a friend who, now in the riper reaches of five decades, was given it by his mother when he left home for college. It's been sluggish, fretful company and I a reluctant keeper til I found tfl which is a little like finding bread religion..multidenominational of course..So anyway my starter woke up recently with a flower in its hair and a song in its heart, don't ask me why, I just thought I better use it and not ask any questions. The wind could and probably will change directions any day. These are a couple loaves of Vermont Sourdough, and an edition of Dan Lepard's White Leaven bread.

and with the fresh discard:

This is an adaptation of Hamelman's Golden Raisin bread, obviously unbound by particulars... Oatmeal bread is typically snugged up with sugar, fat and spices--this loaf is so warm and country without those things that it should have pigtails and a checkered shirt.

-brown dog, white horse.