Hi all!

I'm a semi-lousy cook on the best of days, so bread baking is truly pushing my personal skill level envelope...

I got started on this quest through Bittman's No-Knead bread and the NYT. It WORKED. It was just a bit bland, though...So, while searching the Web for No-Knead recipes, to see if I could add milk, or buttermilk, eggs, sugar, etc., I came across a recipe that was published in the "Bread Baker Bible," for Casserole Bread.

Casserole Bread was even easier than No-Knead. Mix the ingredients (Proof 2 pkg yeast in 1C milk, 3 Tbs. sugar, 1 1/2 Tbs. butter, scalded and cooled, add 4 1/2 C. flour mixed with 1 Tbs. salt) for 2 minutes, cover and let rise for 40-45 minutes until doubled, beat vigorously for 30 seconds, pour into a greased 1 1/2 qt. casserole, and bake 50-60 minutes at 375.

The recipe made too much dough, more to fit a 2 qt., but it was EASY. I got distracted, and think I added water twice, because again, the loaf was heavy and dense, but MUCH tastier than the basic No-Knead. It LOOKED really odd, though, because of not having a rise time and skin formation. The crust is very thin, and while the top looks pretty "bread like," the parts that are in contact with the pan have "bubble craters" on the surface...Tasty, though. Very, very tasty.

Have any of you ever tried this type of bread? If so, any tips or suggestions would be appreciated. I will be making this one again, at least a few times, to see if my results were consistent, and to see if reducing the water makes a better loaf. The crumb was beautiful, just somewhat "soggy" and squeezable. The kind of bread, you pull the middle out of and can squeeze and play with before you eat it...

Will update you with my progress.

~Kizzle

I have been working with the Cook's Magazine "Almost No Knead" recipe, which seems pretty slick to me. Trouble is, after baking the recipe a number of times, I feel there is an either/or issue resolving hydration vs rise and shape stability. I do my second rise on a parchment sheet lowered into a bowl (boule?) shaped like the rounded loaf I hope for. When the second rise is complete, I remove the parchment sling, slash the loaf, then lower it into the 6 quart dutch oven for baking. The loaf is about an inch less in diameter than the pot.

Now for the tragic outcome: The loaf subsides into something like a very thick Frisbee. It springs pretty well and the interior is uniformly holey. Tastes great. But.... I'd like a nice upstanding loaf that is a good deal rounder. I don't want a basketball, but should I reduce the hydration to make a stiffer dough? Is there just something inherent in the no knead regieme that makes a more slack dough? Anyone have strategies for "stiffening the spine" of my boules without giving up their nice moist chewiness?

Thanks for your ideas.

Hello all!

I made this recipe http://www.cookingbread.com/classes/class_no_knead_bread_ta.html this weekend and it turned out FANTASTIC!  This was my first no-knead bread in a dutch oven (just purchased it that day).  The look and taste was exactly what I expected.  I couldn't have had a better experience with it.

Tim

This is in response to Trailrunner's questions on a mixing discussion over at Hansjoakim's blog here on a fantastic-looking crumb he has on his Hazelnut bread.

Lately I seem to get best results with a combo of warm shorter bulk ferment with frequent early folding and long cold final proof. No mixer, no kneading with flour, no repeated French-folding. (warning, this could change as soon as I read of a better method, so please take with a grain of sea salt!):

• Hand mix all the ingredients with a large dough whisk in large bowl (incl. salt)
• Cover and let rest (autolyse) for 30 min. (I know you are supposed to leave out the salt but I find it easier to mix everything initially if not using a standmixer)
• After 30 min. rest, use plastic dough scraper to fold dough onto itself in the same bowl, just like what Mark does in his video here. I count to about 100 as that takes me just about 3 min., and that has seemed to develop the dough well.
• Next round up the dough with scaper and place it into a clean, lightly spray-oiled lidded dough bucket - or for large-size doughs where I double or triple the formula, I use a big square clear plastic food service container with lid.
• Let the dough sit for 30 min. (preferably at 76F location), then do a single stretch & fold as per Hamelman: if dough is in smaller bucket, tip the dough out onto a lightly spray-oiled counterstop, stretch it out into a rectangle, and letter fold it onto itself once, rotate 90 degrees, letter fold again, and put it back in the bucket for another 30 minutes. If dough is in big square container, just fold it right in the container and turn upside down when done.
• Repeat step above 2 more times for a total of 3 folding sessions spread 30 min. apart. Then leave the dough to finish bulk-fermenting at 76F, usually for another 90-120 minutes until just doubled (my home-made starter is not that fast a riser).
• Next shape loaves, then I place the shaped loaves in a 45-50F location (my unheated mudroom) to retard overnight or 12 hrs min.
• After cold retarding I place the proofed loaves in my room temp (65F) kitchen while I preheat my baking stone for 45 min. and bake with steam right after that, usually the loaves are proofed enough after all that time retarding, and the oven spring is great.

Here are results of a less slack dough (65% hydration pain au levain 10% whole wheat), not huge holes like you'd get with a very wet dough, but large enough and evenly distributed, and very flavorful crumb, chewy but not gummy:

I still need to try SteveB's double-mixing technique he describes here. If anyone sees any error in my ways with how I've been doing this, I'm all ears! I'm sure I'll revise this after I read Advanced Bread and Pastry, due in soon.

No- Knead @ Sea

Galley Wench

I have a few questions about strech and folding.

1. For whole wheat sourdough how much time should be allowed between foldings?

2. Should my dough pass a window pane test if I am folding instead of kneading?

3. Can any recipe adapted to strech and fold?  If so does all the streching and foldinf and resting time create a problem of ovr proofing if I add in enough time for a good rise?  Will the yeasts be over popullating the dough by the time it rises if I take the time to strech and fold it over a period of 3 hours instead of a straight kneading which would take 20 min.? 

Well, I made those baguettes I'd been craving. Simple really -- I just did the NYT / Sullivan Street bread scaled down to make three 8-ounce baguettes. Well, I also substituted 10% of the white flour for whole spelt, because I had some on hand, brought the hydration down to 75% and folded it twice before going to bed.

They were very tasty, almost buttery, and the crust was perfect. Crunchy and full of flavor. Crumb was nice too, with the irregularly shaped , though not cavernous, holes I was hoping for.

Man, though, were they butt-ugly.

Hi, guys. I am mightily frustrated this afternoon following my third bad experience with cold-start baking of no-knead bread. I know I've made it work a few times, but when it goes bad, it's a mess. Basically, the bread bakes into the pan and cannot be dislodged without destroying the loaf altogether. I've tried it with two different baking vessels, both of which work great when preheated to blistering temps. I have had the same experience with traditional loaf pans - even when I oiled the heck out of them first.

When you make this, how much starter do you use, at what hydration? How vigorous is your starter? The first time I tried this, I used way too much starter, I think 80 grams.   In the morning my dough had obviously risen and tanked.  Last night I used 6 grams of 60% hydration starter.  AFter 13 hours it had done very little. Since I don't want to go another day without bread, I just added a bunch more starter and will watch it like a hawk.  At 180 grams I probably used too much!