The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

gluten development

Song Of The Baker's picture

Gluten Development Techniques - What to do!?

October 31, 2012 - 5:24pm -- Song Of The Baker

Something that I have been wondering lately since learning how to make Tartine's Country Loaf.

Is there a reason that any other technique to develop gluten would be used other than the 'in-bowl pull-fold and rotate' method??

Why all the mess, and flour/oil waste, the sore arms and stress?

There MUST be a reason why the whole world has not switched from the painful old-fashioned kneading process to Chad's (originally French) method.  Right?  If there are, please enlighten this lazy amateur.


ehanner's picture

Stretch and Fold-In the Bowl

April 4, 2011 - 6:07am -- ehanner

I wanted to create a searchable link to the Illustration provided by long time contributor and all around good guy, Mebake (Khalid). Khalid has taken pen to paper and shown us how to accomplish the procedure of developing gluten and strength in higher hydration dough. His Illustration is very clear and easy to understand. Personally, I use this method nearly every time I bake and find it a valuable tool that doesn't make a mess in the kitchen and has little physical impact, unlike conventional kneading.

Rick D's picture

Gluten gone bad

June 13, 2010 - 8:56pm -- Rick D

I have a gluten question:

What could have possibly happened to the gluten structure during the first rise of my bread today?

This was a cinnamon/raisin bread which I've done many, many times with dry commercial yeast (recipe from RL Beranbaum's "The Bread Bible"), but this time, tried with a starter. My first attempt at this was more successful, but something strange happened today.

katyajini's picture

Stretch and fold, when, how many times, how often?

November 11, 2009 - 9:25am -- katyajini

I (am very new to bread baking and) want to use the stretch and fold technique that I have been reading about here.  I don’t have a mixer and I want make very wet doughs like for focaccia and ciabatta.   I have done the no-knead method and autolyse and know very well that you can make tasty bread without any kneading whatsoever.  And I am intrigued by the knowledge that whipping the day light out of a dough results in over oxygenation and actually less tasty bread and therefore leaning ever more toward stretch and fold.  

LLM777's picture

gluten development

November 10, 2009 - 6:03pm -- LLM777

If my bread has more of a homemade muffin texture than bread texture, does that mean I'm not developing the gluten enough? I'm using freshly ground grains and overnight refrigeration. It also passes the window pane test. I never see many, if any, holes. I'm at 65% hydration; if I go any more it doesn't hold it's shape. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

parousia's picture

100% hydration whole wheat sourdough

November 6, 2007 - 4:19pm -- parousia

Greetings All,


This somehow happened in my wife's kitchen. Perhaps it was the chowder on the stove.

This is a 100% Hydration, 100% whole wheat bread with 100% whole wheat 100%hydration starter.


200g fresh ground Wheat Montana Prarie Gold.

200g tap water and .5 tsp salt

flour and 175g water mixed and allow sit 12 hours in fridge

25g water added and sit 6hrs

mountaindog's picture

help for overproofed loaves?

February 26, 2007 - 11:08am -- mountaindog

For about the past 2-3 weeks, it seems that my Thom Leonard boules, which I have made every week since about November, are suddenly coming out overproofed even though I have not changed my technique: as soon as the loaves are slashed on the peel and hit the hot oven stone, they collapse and spread out at the slashes.

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