I had an odd experience yesterday making the dough for Tartine Country Bread.. I normally us KA AP flour - because I think it yields a softer textured crumb - I had found that using KA bread flour was easier to work with - but once I got more comfortable with slap and fold, etc. - working with all purpose was fine.  I had some bread flour left over that I wanted to use - so I used it and 10% wheat flour with the standard recipe yesterday.  I do the initial mix in a spiral mixer.  What was odd, was that during the initial mix, the doug came together unusually quickly - in less than 3 minutes of mixing I had a very cohesive ball.  A let it autolyse for about 25 minutes and then added the salt (Black Diamond Kosher) and 50g more water to bring the dough to 75% hydration.. Usually when I add the water and the salt, the dough comes apart and then comes back together... this time - the dough stayed in a cohesive mass (one chunk broke off - but stayed as a separate piece (still using spiral mixer)).  I added 50 more grams of water (now 80% hydration) - but the dough didn't really come apart. To avoid over kneading, I turned off after 4 minutes and put it into a large plastic tub that I always use for the bulk ferment.  The dough already felt developed at this point in terms of elasticity - also strange.  I then ended up having to go to an unexpected appointment after the first turn (30 minutes into the bulk ferment).  Because I was going to be gone for several hours, I put the dough in the refrigerator to retard the bulk ferment.  I was gone for about 3.5 hours - when I returned, I completed the 2nd turn.  Again, the dough already seemed to have very high elasticity and the texture was like a fully proofed dough.  At any rate, i did two more turns and then did the initial shaping about 5 hours later.  During the initial shaping, the dough had high elasticity and essentially maintained it's shape as a ball (never had that happen before).  30 minutes later I did the final shape and again put the dough back in the refrigerator and then slashed and baked it about 7.5 hours later.  here is the result. It's been quite dry in Northern California where I bake - I'm not sure if that's why the flour absorbed so much flour so quickly - but the bread turned out surprisingly well given all the timing errors through the bulk ferment and the final proofing.  The crumb texture is also remarkably tender for using bread flour.. I'm a bit confused about why it had such significant oven spring.

Hi All,

Does anyone have experience using general mills harvest king flour?  I have been using it for a long time and wonder if I should use this flour in a bakery.  It is fairly low in gluten, 11.5%.

Thank you,

Gena

I like to make standard hydration sourdough and french-type breads.  Here in Hawaii, the only bulk-type flour I can reasonably afford is the ConAgra Harvest Blend bread flour, sold by COSTCO. I can purchase 25 pounds for the price of 10 pounds of national brands. Does any one have an opinion about how much quality I would gain by paying about $7 for five pounds of King Arthur bread flour.

The ConAgra also contains Ascorbic Acid. Do I need to compensate for that in some way? Some days I think the problems are with the baker and some days I wonder about the ingredients! If I keep improving my skills (which I'd say are intermediate) can I work around a less than ideal flour?

Any experiences or advice would be welcomed.

I live in rural Central America and the local people really enjoy the Americano baked goods I make. In most recipes, I found I can substitute AP, but am afraid to try others as I have no access to bread flour. Does anyone know of a viable substitute that would not include a 12 hour ride on a chicken bus to the next country over (If they even have it). Thanks and Feliz Navidad y Feliz Año Nuevo from the third hut from the river just past the palm trees.

I forgot to mention in the origal post, we do not have postal service here, so ordering over the internet is not an option.

Hi there,

Anyone have any good or bad baking experiences to share using flours from Great River Organic Milling in Wisconsin?  No shipping fees thru Amazon & they have an organic 100% Whole Wheat bread flour.  They used to be Little Bear Milling, which was one of the recommended sources for good flour in Laurel's Bread Book.

I have just ordered some, but says it's 2-5 WEEKS for shipping. 

I have been trying other flours, but so far most are not ground finely enough to make the high and light 100% WW loaves I loved back when Walnut Acres (PA) was still in the flour business.

Thanks,

Maryann in VA

What is the best flour to use for pizza? I tried Peter Reinhart's recipe using bread flour, and it was kind of eerr... chewy... while using all purpose flour yielded a softer nicer dough..... just wanna know, what do you guys use? Which is better, and why is bread flour so chewy? btw - i'm aiming for a thin crust pizza...thanks.

Sue

Hi Guys,

I just got hold of a copy of the Bread Bakers Apprentice, and so far it's living up to the praises I've been reading all over the interwebs.

However, right now I'm living in Denmark, and as far as flour goes we're/they're clearly living in the past (sometimes it does feel like living in an isolated world, up here) - or, at least, the selection of flour is no near as wide as in the US. I've been able to find no stores that specifically cater to bakers, so I'm stuck with the kind of flour that is sold in the supermarkets, which is really poor. The absolute highest protein content I've been able to find in any flour was 12 grams per 100 grams, and that flour is bleached. In addition, I have no idea about the quality of this flour; I haven't seen this brand in many stores.

Reinhart keeps emphasizing, in his book, how important the flour is (as well as primary fermentation, of course ;) ) - should I go ahead using this flour, or would the extra cost of importing flour from outside the country be worthwhile? Am I obsessing to much?

BTW. the bakers around here aren't really any good, so I don't really think trying to buy flour off them would be worthwhile.

Thanks for you time guys, and thanks for a great resource!

Hi! Everyone!  I am new to this and need some help.  I want to make German Soft Pretzels and it calls for 1C of Bread flour. (3C's All Purpose Flour)  Now I understand I think the higher the proteens means it reacts better with the yeast.  So my normal flour is Wheat Flour and has 16.64% proteens. Which I use like all purpose flour in the USA.  I went out and bought another flour which I was told was for bread and it has 17.36% proteens.  When I made bread in the USA I bought Bread Flour which is no big deal.  Here, everything is a big deal, believe me.  I even have learned to make Choc. pudding from scratch and it is a lot of work but Gee! I forgot just how good stuff taste when I was a kid and mom made it from scratch.  So, what do I do?  Are both flours good enough to use or make bread, or should I use the 17.36% proteen flour?  Please help, you all seem to know what you are doing when it comes to flour.  Thanks Jim

I’ve been working since September to produce my own “perfect” sourdough bread. Three weeks ago I was pretty much there, but you know, I keep tweaking, trying to make it more sour, and the recipe more reliable. Well, my tweak this time was changing flour. I’d been using KA Bread flour, but kept reading about people using KA All-Purpose flour and it was “just the same,” “worked just as well,” etc., etc. They never said it was just as good but different. . .

I had promised to bring two loaves to the Easter Dinner party we were invited to, so I took my starter out of the fridge Thursday night and started feeding it: quarter cup of bread flour, two tablespoons purified water, twice a day. This starter is happy, vigorous, bubbly, and I’ve come to understand that the fault lies with the baker in this house, not with the starter. It’s been very patient with me as I’ve struggled to learn.

This morning I started my bread, using about 1/2 cup of starter, along with some preferment, and adding those to 500 gm warm purified water. I added 750 gm flour (350 each of bread flour and AP flour, with 50 gm of rye flour) and 15 gm salt. It was very shaggy, much more than I remembered. Hm. Can’t be all that different, right? It’ll come along. I rolled it into a ball and put it into an oiled container in my rising area. Did hourly stretch-and-folds four times. The dough was so wet I ended up working on a floured surface, with floured hands.

I cut it in half, shaped it into two loaves and put them into my floured couche. An hour into the rise I started to preheat my oven to 500 degrees. And put my cast iron Dutch oven in there as well, hoping it would be my life saver. (It was. . .)

An hour and forty-five minutes of proofing and they were ready to go, but I could see that they were still soft and would not likely maintain their shape. The first loaf basically de-gassed as I rolled it onto the Silpat mat I use for baking. Bummer.  I poured the other loaf into the heated Dutch oven, sprayed it with water, and covered it. I dropped the temperature to 470 and baked them for thirty minutes. The loaf was done, but pale and misshapen.  I took the cover off the Dutch oven and gave it another ten minutes at 450. It was a glorious honeyed mahogany color, with a few surface bubbles and some shallow thin streaks of cracking (I’ll bet there’s a term for that that I don’t know. . . I never slashed the surface, but it did break open beautifully with these feathery trails.)

I’d love to say that the pictures are here, but the loaf traveled to our dinner party on the cooling rack in the back seat of the car. It was consumed in total with oohs and ahhs, enjoyed by all. I’ll do it again. WOW!  The flavor was full, nutty. Not “sour” enough, but probably sour to some.  The crumb was grayish (the rye, probably) beautiful, with smaller holes than I had hoped for but lots of them, and that lovely translucence that some bread gets.

So. . . questions and comments:  Did the change to 46.6% AP flour make the difference in wetness? If so, I will go back to 100% bread flour. Is the success of Dutch oven baking more reliable? (I was desperate that at least ONE of my loaves “work!” and the Dutch oven did it with dough I thought was a loss.) With dough that wet, how could I have increased the flour after the first stretch-and-fold with any reliability, to something that would have worked as loaves. . . ?

. . . and how do I make it more sour? I’ve been reluctant to go to the citric salt that I understand is used by many commercial bakers, but maybe it’s time. 

Thanks for any comments or suggestions – love hearing from the experts and hard-working wannabees on this site. It’s awesome!

Peggy