The Fresh Loaf

A Community of Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts.

How to introduce somebody to baking

Salome's picture
Salome

How to introduce somebody to baking

I baked a bread today. Not exactly as I would normally, as I baked with my room mate's boyfriend, who is an "artist". Meaning, he's very spontaneous and would for instance never use measuring cups or scales. He loves my bread and was very eager to learn some of my skills. The only obstacle: this "scientific" way of baking just doesn't suit him.

How do you deal with people who would like to learn from you, without ever being willing to measure things, follow times ...?

I told him more about common proportions, like e.g. 1 cube of fresh yeast per kilo of flour, 1 tablespoon of salt for the same amount, gave him some inputs about how to get his loaves pleasantly moist (soaking seeds after toasting, etc.), showed him how wet a whole-wheat dough should be, how to knead properly and indicated how he could test whether a dough is fully risen. And showed him to shape a loaf. 

The bread we baked together tastes good, it just doesn't look like from a bakery as he shaped it and treated it.

If you have an apprentice, how strictly do you follow your own "baking rules"? What do you think is the most important thing to get across when teaching about bread? Do you "dare" to bring up all these scientific things, like gluten bonding, yeast producing co2 (well I told him the yeasties are farting... ;) ), etc.? I just simplified it as much as possible without losing the point.

I'm interested in hearing you experiences!

Salome

flournwater's picture
flournwater

One persons "artist" is another persons renigade. Those who steadfastly believe they can refuse to follow rules are often surprised to learn that they cannot escape the rules of science/physics.  When I teach someone I insist that the introduction period belongs to me - the student can do what he or she chooses after they've graduation, but they must first learn the basics in the manner I offer them; no exceptions.  If that's not acceptable we don't even get started because I refuse to waste my time.  Without an understanding of the basics that you offered to teach (i.e. ingredients and how they relate/react to one another) your student will spend a lot of tiem struggling and his success will be sporadic and unexplainable.

I think you're quite generous to even consider offering to help someone like that.

Elagins's picture
Elagins

true artistry/creativity is about mastering a medium and then pushing its limits beyond the conventional. case in point: picasso's progression as an artist, from Academician to cubist to brilliant visionary and innovator in his own right. pollack, rothko, modigliani -- all of them started with academic still lifes and portrait studies; bach, rachmaninoff, stravinsky, philip glass, jimi hendrix all started by learning chords and scales and practicing them over and over. only then could they credibly push the limits.

your roommate's friend is less an "artist" than he is a truculent child who's still rebelling against his parents and insisting that he do it "his way" or not at all. avoid him.

Yerffej's picture
Yerffej

Success in any endeavor can come from the most unlikely and surprising sources.  What is the goal?  To insist that someone must do it your way or to show someone how you do it?

Worry not and relax.  Happy Thanksgiving and be very grateful that we all bring something different to the discussion.

Jeff

summerbaker's picture
summerbaker

True.  Plus, sometimes just showing someone how YOU make a success of something, without saying "you MUST do it this way," is inspiring enough that they will use your tried and true techniques because they see the possibility that they will work.  Then that person will be much more likely to try it for himself, which is key.  For your teaching to sink in and be incorporated into another person's process it has to also work for him.  I know this from having been a music teacher for the last ten years.  I get all kinds of students but leading by example continues to be the backbone of my teaching.  It's even good to mess up in front of them and let them see how you deal with it.  I show them how I use my own advice all of the time.  Hope this helps.

Summer

Salome's picture
Salome

Thank you for your interesting contributions!

Maybe I should put it differently - how much complicated "chemistry" can somebody who is new to baking digest? and not only digest, which simple rules are the most useful? Whether they're "artists", messies or whatsoever - how deeply would you explain what actually happens and what they need to pay attention to?

The aim of showing him how to bake is not to make a genious out of him. He does show genuine interest in baking, also in the theoretical aspects. I liked his interest and thought simply that I'd need to match my introduction to baking to the student. Explaining him the importance of adding exactly two percent of salt to a dough just doesn't make any sense. I know and like him, and I know that he doesn't even posess a scale. How would he ever find any use in such advice?

I don't think that everybody needs to make such a fuss about baking like you and I do. Not everybody derives pleasure from reading bread books before falling a sleep. and that's fine! I mean, nor did our grandmothers, which baked by feeling and still had great results.I do enjoy the most complex theory about baking, but - honestly - wouldn't I be making a fool of my self if I'd explain the complex mechanisms of baking to somebody who is already very happy with a simple bread which is far away from being perfect? And who wouldn't have any use in these theories anyway?

 

apprentice's picture
apprentice

Thank you for your fascinating question! It reminded me of a wonderful little book that George Leonard wrote in the early '90s called Mastery: The keys to success and long-term fulfillment. He says that one of the keys to the mastery of anything is surrendering to your teacher and the demands of your discipline. To learn, one must be willing to be a beginner. When you are no longer a rank beginner, you also have to surrender at different stages what you think you know in order to move on to the next level.

Leonard tells stories, too, about what it is that makes a master teacher. Chiefly, he believes it is the one who seeks skillful ways to involve the student actively in the process of learning. Bravo for being willing to look more deeply at what your particular student needs at the introductory stage. Only time will tell whether he wants to achieve some level of mastery or just dabble at baking before moving on to some other enthusiasm.

turosdolci's picture
turosdolci

Some people just don't have the knack for baking. I have some people exactly as you have explained.  I try working with them on things they really like and let them make their mistakes if they chose to do it their way.  They will discover that spending the time and money to prepare something that doesn't work out isn't fun or tasty.  I actually spent Thanksgiving eve with someone trying to make a pie crust after many failures.  Even as I instructed her on the phone, it didn't come out right and I am sure that her measurements were wrong.  I actually had my husband do the exact same thing, at the same time and his came out great and he never made a pie crust in his life. I'm in Europe and this person is in the US so the call was long distance. I've made arrangements with her to make pie crust until she gets it right in a few weeks when I'm in the US.  She is now so frustrated that she is willing to listen. She is also a artist type, but I am an artist also but know that there are certain rules I have to follow to get good results. Let him make his mistakes and spend the time and money and maybe he will come around.

Good Luck!

salma's picture
salma

I am an avid lurker here.  I get lots of ideas and recipes on this sight and bake at least once a week or more.  I try to encourage others to bake if they show interest.  NKB is perhaps the least amt of work for people who think breadbaking is a lot of work.  Even then the time involved scares them.  Simple soft rolls made with yeast in about 3 hours gives quicker if not immediate rewards.  An acquaintance finally made the NKB and is now doing variations with the ingredients.  When I saw her last, she told me that she is now the bread person at dinner gatherings.

Salma

RuthieG's picture
RuthieG

Perhaps you taught him enough to make him want to learn the specifics. 

Janknitz's picture
Janknitz

You just have to give them the basics and let them fly.  You'll be amazed at what they can do!

I say you teach him to make a basic loaf and give him as much information as he wants to have.  He'll probably ask a lot of questions and internalize what he needs to take off from there.  In addition, you need to show him how a dough should look, act, and feel. 

After that, he can experiment on his own.  Let him know he can always come back to the basic recipe if he is not succeeding, but my guess is he'll do fine.  Most of our grandmothers made bread without measuring very precisely.  And if you've ever watched a video of Jim Lahey and Mark Bittman doing the original no-knead bread (and the second iteration of the bread, too), you will see a creative genius at work.  Nothing is precise, but it doesn't matter. 

Some of us are "blind followers" who have to follow a recipe to a T, some of us are "scientists" who have to figure out how everything works and then tweak it to our own expectations while being precise for repeatable and predictable results, and some of us are "artists" who bring a sense of creativity and experimentation to the process.  All can produce great bread.  That's what makes it so darn FUN!

There's someone on the Knitlist who always says it, but it really applies even more here:  "It's not rocket science, it's just bread."

 

Patf's picture
Patf

A friend wanted to start making bread "by hand" instead of in her machine, so I invited her

 to watch me when I baked on Tuesday. So she stayed up to the first rise, then we watched a couple of videos from this site. There's quite a choice, she liked the ones from Mark's Home Bakery.

I think bread baking is more complicated than it first appears, for example have you ever tried writing a recipe? So best to start with basics as simple as possible.