Steel vs stone under combo pot
I just had a minor catastrophe- my baking stone is now in 4 pieces! I dropped it while taking it out of the oven. (It was not hot. I had just decided to take it out of the oven.) so this is my dilemma. I have been mostly using it under my combo pot while baking levain breads, because I discovered that if I leave the baking stone in the oven while preheating the pot and place the pot on it while baking, I no longer get burnt bottoms. This is a duscovery that I made and reported in a previous post: http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/49707/burnt-bottom-dutch-oven-baked-loaves
I also like to make pizza from time to time and understand that a steel might be a bit better for that use. So I am trying to decide if I should replace the stone with a steel. Will a steel underneath the pot work as well as the stone in preventing burning? Does anyone know this first hand?
I know that a steel is highly touted for pizza-making, but I want a replacement that will serve well for both bread and pizza. Also, is there a downside in keeping a steel in the oven all of the time? My understanding was that it is not advisable to keep a stone in the o en because of its impact on other cooking. I don’t know if this is true of the stone as well.
So, any advice would be helpful.
In my experience I prefer a stone to steel for bread baking. I have used both. The steel burns the bottom of my breads. Maybe others have a different experience. I like the stone much better than the steel. The steel may be slightly better for pizza, but not by a lot, IMO.
I generally leave the stone in the oven, but it does take longer to pre-heat with the stone in.
I am surprised to read that a stone under your cast iron prevents burned bottoms. I haven’t had that problem at all. I believe a lot of people bake in a DO without ant steel or stone.
Have you tried raising the oven shelf and baking in your DO without a stone?
QUESTION - is your oven gas or electric? My opinions are based using an electric oven.
Dan
Dan- My oven is also electric. You may be right that elevating the pot by moving it to a higher rack might achieve the save thing as putting it on the stone, but I think if I use a higher rack, it may be more difficult to uncover the he pot while it is in the oven.
no harm in keeping your stone or steel in the oven... they all help to retain the heat within the oven when you are baking. in fact, i'd consider leaving that broken stone in your oven if you have the space. i have switched to steel, (i left my stone in the oven). and it doesn't move, unless i'm making pizza... when i move the whole rack up a level to be closer to the broiler.
i don't experience any burnt bottoms on my bread baking on a steel, although i use parchment paper. i have baked within my dutch oven, placed right onto the steel and had no problems. i would expect your dutch oven
steel generally tends to be more expensive than the stone... i wouldn't get anything thinner than .25 inch. their biggest advantage is the ability to radiate heat, which stones do not do well. thicker steels will retain heat better than thinner (but are also heavier).
a baking steel is extremely versatile. if you have a gas stovetop, you can even use them as a griddle! check out bakingsteel on instagram for a never ending source of inspiration.
happy baking!
Thank you for your thoughts. Now I still don’t know what I should do. You seem to prefer the steel; Dan prefers the stone! I like your suggestion about putting the broken stone back in the oven for a while. At least it will have the effect of not making any quick decision! I may check out videos showing the sreel’s use as a griddle, as I do have a gas cooktop.
steel for pizza is really great...I love mine...esp. using the broiler method (but a stone is great too)
as for preventing burnt bottoms in your combo cooker...I use either a piece of foil or a cookie sheet on a rack below the rack the cooker is on. Makes all the difference...
i probably should try your cookie sheet method before I am in a hurry to replace the stone. If I solve the burnt bottom problem with your method, I could get a steel for pizza instead of replacing the stone with another. Now, I will have to decide if a steel is really worth the higher price and higher maintenance.
Caryn, I think you have some good ideas to try. Is your stone able to be peiced together and used as is?
The baking pan idea sounds good. I wonder if you placed the baking pan on a shelf under the shelf holding the pot if that wouldn’t work for you. Maybe you don’t need the stone. There are plenty of options to try. Maybe pot the pot on top of the peiced together stone. Many bakes have cracked stones and continue to bake on them. Alfanso has baked on cracked stones quite a bite, and he produces expert results.
Dan
Dan- Thanks for your suggestions. I can still at least place the pot on the largest of the pieces and/or put a sheet pan on the rack below. It may be a while since I seem to have a lot of bread in my freezer currently!
Here is a related question (hope OP doesn't mind):
Just acquired a large oval GraniteWare covered roaster to use as a DO when baking batards. Made of enameled steel so wondering if there would be benefit to lining the bottom surface with rectangular 1/2" quarry tiles cut to best fit. Seems that it would be beneficial in holding the heat during initial steaming stage.
In the past I've baked bread directly on tiles, with a large thin aluminum cover. Never got the spring I thought I should. Perhaps "DO plus tiles" would be better -- just like my cast-iron Lodge for boules.
What do you think?
Gerry, it mght be worth a try. But this is what I often do. I pre-heat a stone and also the highest part of the roaster. Then I place the bread on the stone and cover with the roaster.
Caroline, aka “TrailRunner” (my Granite Ware guru) says she only uses the GW without any stone and geats great results. I have baked this way and had very good results. No need to spend extra time heating the stone. Once the oven comes to temp you are ready to bake. GW vs, Cast Iron in a nut shell - - - Cast Iron is heavy and a great heat sink, but once it is removed from the hot oven and relatively cool bread is placed inside, the temp drops drastically and recover of that heat is slow. GW looses heat quickly and when the relaively cool bread is placed inside the heat is also sucked out of the vessel. BUT GW recovers heat much faster than cast iron. It goes against common sense, I know. But I think the data bears out the facts. For me, until I learn different, GW is the hands down winner.
I ran some experiments here in case you are interested. http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/56822/cast-iron-cooker-vs-graniteware-thermal-data NOTE - this data was gathered using a baking stone with each vessel placed on top.
Dan
You've done some really interesting work in this area. Didn't realize that this was such a "hot" topic.
In my prior baking I've used a stone surface and covered bread with an aluminum multi-ply roasting pan. Results were "fair" -- not as much much spring as I thought there would be.
I've baked boules in a CI DO. (No stone surface used). Spring was very good. Excellent bake.
Now that I have both stone and GW roaster wondering if placing covered GW (aka DO) directly on heated stone will give me the best of both worlds -- hold the heat, and seal in the steam.
If bottom of the bread burns, can always add a wire rack to lift the loaf. (Embedded pattern on GW bottom might serve the same purpose).
There is no one right way to do anything when it comes to bread baking. Great bakers swear by differing methods, formulas, techniques, you name it... And they can all be extremely successful. I suggest you try different methods and use that which works best for you.
Thankfully, I have not experienced a lot of burnt bottoms on my breads.
Dan