The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Another try at open crumb

  • Pin It
MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

Another try at open crumb

I have been baking! (big surprise...)

This time I was thinking that I should get gluten development, but not too much gluten alignment, so I tried Autolyse.

The crumb turned out nice and moist, with very irregular bubbles, but it's still not there yet.

I made my poolish as usual, 200g flour / 200g water and a pea-sized amount of yeast.

The next day I mixed the remaining 310g flour and 190g water and let it stand for 3 hours.

I then mixed the two (with a little trouble, because of the hydration difference), added oil, a pea-size yeast, and 10g of kosher salt.

It was then put in a box to bulk ferment for 3 hours, with S&F every hour.

Then it was put in a claypot for final proofing.

About 1½-2 hours later, it was put cold into the oven, covered, hoping steam would build up and help, at 525F/275C for 50 minutes.

 

The crumb was the most moist I have had yet. I guess this is the Autolyse? It's wonderful

The crust is no that great, but since it would go soft before tomorrow anyway, that doesn't bother me.

The dough held together okay, but had to bake it in a form of some sort. I guess high hydration dough is always baked with strong preheating? Or is it possible to shape it to last?

The bubbles look horizontal, maybe they could have expanded more upwards. Should I have scored the bread for better result? And yea, should have dimpled, have to learn to remember that...

Next time I am going to preheat, and I will match the hydration between the poolish and the autolysed dough so it mixes easier, and I will agitate the dough less.

Any other suggestions? For bigger holes and such..

 

hamletcat's picture
hamletcat

I gave up and ended using the dough setting on my bread maker before letting it ferment for 8+ hrs.  It was the only way I seemed to be able to get enough gluten.  I might try the slap and fold method next time.  The bread turned out lovely once the gluten was formed properly.

MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

So what does the dough setting do? Sorry, I have never used a bread maker, I thought it was just an electronically timed heated box that could proof and bake during the night..

hamletcat's picture
hamletcat

It is!  But mine has a dough setting that will just mix/knead the dough for you.  It saves doing it by hand.  I just put in my recipe which is just 3 1/4c. bread flour, 1 1/2 tsp salt, 1 1/2 c. water and 1/4 tsp yeast.  After it mixed the dough which took about 2 hrs in the bread maker, I just took it out and let it ferment for 8+ hrs.  I think the advantage was that it developed the gluten properly.  Then it was able to trap the bubbles better.

MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

Ah okay, like that... I am kind of mixed between if kneading should be done by machine, by hand, or by autolyse, and until now Autolyse has given the softest, least uniform crumb for me.

So I am doing 3-4 hours Autolyse (2h should be optimal, but I am at school for 3 hours), then 3-4 hours fermenting with stretch and fold now and then. It is actually quite relaxing, the dough feels so nice and smooth to the touch, it's a real pleasure :)

WoodenSpoon's picture
WoodenSpoon

If my preferment is wetter then my final dough I will usually add it to the autolyse, holding back just the salt, That might help a little with trying to incorperate em after the autolyse. Also whats the dimpeling that you spoke of? and finally did you shape that loaf before proofing it in yer clay pot or did you just toss the dough in?

MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

I read somewhere about adding levain before autolyse, but afaik, that means specifically sourdough preferment, right?

Dimpling is poking the surface of the bread with your fingers to collapse the bigger airbubles in the surface. Here's a description of it: http://www.breadcetera.com/?p=96

WoodenSpoon's picture
WoodenSpoon

ya know, I'm not sure how that would work with commercially yeasted prefrements, I'v been a pretty strict sourdough guy lately. You are right, levain is usually used to talk about sourdough preferment, though it also can be translated to leaven in french, so I suppose if you were talking to a frenchman who didn't know his bread he might use levain to describe commercially yeasted preferments... ahh, I didn't know you were making focaccia, that makes much more sense.

MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

Hehe, I'm actually not, but I am very much under the impression that it is something you do in any case to mase sure the crust has a nice even thickness. No my bread is just baked in a weird way, in a lack of equipment, so the shape is a little.. Special..

WoodenSpoon's picture
WoodenSpoon

I have never dimpled anything other then focaccia and I don't think I'd recommend dimpling anything you dont want to appear dimpled, and if you are dimpling after proofing on something that is thicker then an inch or so I might go as far as to say that you will never get the crumb you want because of said dimpling.. you got a mixing bowl/colander/other big bowl a tightly knit towel like linen and a sheet pan? I would suggest that you shelf the clay pot for now and next time you bake after bulk fermentation line the bowl with the towl and dust it liberally with flour, then make a round and proof it seam side up in the bowl, when it comes time to bake gently put the sheet pan over the bowl and invert them as a pair, remove the bowl score the loaf and bake that rascal in a oven preheated 50+ degrees higher then you want to bake at, after steaming turn it down., unless you have a stone, then put the sheetpan on upside down and use it as a peel to slide the loaf to the stone. steam the oven however you steam and I think you should have better luck. Also for goodness sake don't dimple it.

 

MBaadsgaard's picture
MBaadsgaard

Thanks for the tips! I actually had the dimpling from a different post where someone commented about a bubble in the surface of a loaf of mine.

My dear mother is actually coming by tomorrow with some nice thick cloth for exactly that purpose, so that is going to be nice.

I have a baking steel and a sheet of aluminium to use as a peel. Still in need of lava stones to create decent steam, since all I have for having the water in is a thin steel bowl.

I will probably be playing with a setup like the one you suggest this coming weekend :)

WoodenSpoon's picture
WoodenSpoon

Wicked, good luck to ya, if I see a troublesome looking surface bubble I wouldn't hesitate to pinch/deflate it, but dimpling seems a lot like intentionally degassing, which is the opposite of the goal if you are about to bake the loaf.