January 21, 2008 - 2:24pm
Milling
I am having trouble finding both rye and ww flour of a sufficiently fine mill. I'm considering buying a mill for this purpose. Does anyone know if the KitchenAid attachment is sufficient? The information on their web-site is a bit vague on this point. For stand alone mills, how much do they tend to weigh and what sort of price are they? I am having no luck finding one for domestic use in Australia and may need to order from the States.
Fiona
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I have a KA grain mill and am still trying to find out the tricks to it. From what I heard and read Nutrimill and whisper mills are much better but also much more expensive. So you have to weigh it out. If you mix your home ground mill with store bought flour you probably woouldn't notice much difference. When I have been trying 100% home milled I've had some problem. Basically having a hard time getting gluten development.
IMHO, KA is not the best for fine mill flour. If you can spend the $$ go with the Nutrimill.
I use the KA mill and have no problems with my doughs. The texture of the flour, I am told is just like King Arthur flour. There are a couple of posts on this forum about the KA mill. The grains have to be run through the mill on a setting of 4 back from fine and then run through again on the fine setting. I use organic hard, red spring wheat, organic spelt (this takes longer, so you can't do as much at one time), and organic rye. You can only do 5 cups at a time, which is 10 cups total after being through twice. Then the machine gets too hot and needs to rest for about an hour, before doing anymore. Grinding your own grain is healthier because it is fresh and the flavor is much better. The price is great too, compared to buying flour. If you buy like 25 or 50 lb. bags, then you will get better prices. If you want to buy a different mill, then Nutrimill is the one that I would get. Be aware though that if there is a stone in your grain, that the Nutrimill can be ruined, but the KA mill will just grind it up.
Hey Ramona, I did try running the grains through twice like you said and it does help. Thanks for the tip. Agree that home grinding is healthy. I hope to do all my flour this way.
Living in Australia, I would imagine it would be cost prohibitive to import a gain mill from the USA.
If you are interested in the KA grain mill, here is my full post on operating instructions
When you use your Kitchean Aid grain mill, the most important points to remember are never let your motor overheat ; monitor the motor's heat and if it feels hot to the touch, simply turn off the mixer and let it cool down (about 30 minutes); never run the grain mill without grain in it and never leave the grain mill unattended while your mixer is on
To mill whole wheat for bread, you generally want to produce a finely ground flour. The KA grain mill needs 2 passes to produce a sufficiently finely milled grain.
> PASS 1 Attach the grain mill to the mixer. Turning clockwise, turn it to the finest setting and then, turning counter-clockwise, back it off to stop 3 or 4 (you should hear clicking sounds). Add your grain and mill it on this setting at speed 10, stopping the mixer if it gets hot to let the motor cool. You will end up with a fairly coarse flour that should feel like medium to coarse sand when you rub it between your fingers.
> PASS 2 Turn the setting clockwise to the finest setting (again, you'll hear the clicking sound), put your coarsely milled grain into the hopper, and mill again, speed 10, at this finest setting. Remember to monitor the motor's heat. The result should be a fairly finely milled wheat grain (similar to King Arthur Whole Grain Flour, if you have ever used this brand). There should be a steady (though thin) flow of flour from the milling mechanism into your bowl.
This "double milling" produces a good whole wheat flour for bread making. I've found that trying to mill whole grain directly on the finest setting puts far too much strain on the mixer motor. Taking a 2-stage approach is slower but produces a fine flour without stressing the mixer too much.
I've never been able to produce a sufficiently fine pastry flour with the KA grain mill. Most users and reviewers agree that the unit just isn't capable of this. You could try triple milling if you want to experiment, but in my experience, milling a third time doesn't produce a flour significantly finer than you get by milling just twice.
Thanks so much for that information subfuscpersona. It's really, really useful. On the basis of your detailed instructions and Ramona's comments, I have gone ahead and ordered the mill. I really just want the mill so I can grind samller amounts of flour rather than buy it by the kg and then let the remainder go rancid. I think I'll have to wait for weeks for it to come form the States but at least I don't have to pay for the postage.
Fiona
I bought a mill from Retsel Australia http://www.retsel.com.au/
It worked very well for me.
Regards
Martin Prior
www.bakerette-cafe.com
Retsel Corporation is a well-known manufacturer of high-end grain mills for home and small bakery use. They have a reputation for quality products.
The grain mills sold on the Retsel Australia site are not manufactured by Retsel Corporation. The true Retsel site is www.retsel.com - the knock-off site is www.retsel.com.au
The true Retsel site has this to say about the Retsel Australia site...
Subfuscpersona;
I did have a look at restel.com.au but I dismissed it on the basis the site was trying to offer too much in one product. Luckily I had aready ordered the KA grain attachment by then. It arrived on Friday. I was very excited but had to wait until last night to grind some grain. Following your instructions, I was very pleased with the outcome. I milled some wheat and it produced a finer flour than the stuff I was buying in the shop (and which cost $5 more per kilo than milling it myself. I figure that after I mill 40kg of wheat, the machine will have paid for itself) which is what I wanted to achieve. I made up the starters for 2 loaves from PR's Whole Grains and I'll bake them tonight. I'm surprised by how much I like that book as I wasn't really interested in whole grains until I bought it. I think the thing I like most about it is that I get the best of both worlds- long, slow ferments yet the capacity to easily fit the baking part in after I come home from work. I'm really glad I had your instructions though because all that came in the box was a small sheet of paper showing the various parts and nothing else.
Next weekend I'm going to make a barely and rye bread.
Fiona
I have found this site to be a wonderful source for bread baking information and I hope you will continue share your own experience with the TFL community.
As for the KA grain mill, the most important thing to remember is don't let your mixer motor get too hot. If you follow that one simple rule, I'm sure that the KA grain mill will serve you well for many years. (I've been using mine for over 25 years.)
best of luck - SF