The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Farmer's Market Week 24 (Pane Maggiore take??? plus Barley/Oat/Flax Porridge Bread)

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golgi70's picture
golgi70

Farmer's Market Week 24 (Pane Maggiore take??? plus Barley/Oat/Flax Porridge Bread)

Winter Market 2 for me (I've missed quite a few as I'm taking my weekend back for a bit).  Yet another variation on the Pane Maggiore that I so adore (rhymed)  This variation came out of necessity.  Instead of an 18 hour wheat levain at 1:10:10 I used two levains.  One a whole wheat 1:2:2 for 8 hours and an equal portion of ripe white starter.  Yet again a fantastic loaf.  this may be the best of the bunch but if I recall the one made with 1/2 rye sour and 1/2 white starter was also pretty darn fantastic.  The mix was ideal (except the loss of perfect temp due to chilly kitchen) but the fresh grains kept fermentation vibrant.  I really love this loaf and highly suggest it to all.  The base formula can be found in previous posts of the same loaf.  Of my favorite breads and its 40% whole grain!!!

 Also I'm gonna add some pics of the Pearled/Barley, Steel Cut Oat/Flax Porridge Bread with the T3 as inspiration (used half the porridge he does and my flour blend is 78white20wheat/2rye as I don't have any high extraction flour and didn't want to make it.  Pretty tasty loaf with great keeping quality. 

 

Pane Maggiore

 

And The Barley/Oat/Porridge 

Tartine 3 is really a fantastic book with great inspiration for utilizing whole grains and still attaining an open crumbed loaf of bread.  

 

Josh

Comments

Franko's picture
Franko

Top stuff Josh, those loaves are absolutely stellar, from the rich dark crust with the nice bloom, to the open and creamy looking (for all the grains) crumb. I'll take you up on your suggestion to try the Pane Maggiore, it sure looks like something I'd enjoy. Thanks for posting these!

Cheers,

Franko 

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

best attempt at the Pane Maggiore so far.  Crust and crumb are just perfect.  I have had it on Lucy's bake list since you first posted it on week 6.  Love the 86% hydration but my copy of the formula from the web site translated by Google only has 26% whole grain which makes the dough a really wet one.  The flour in the levain is only 7.8% of the total flour which is why the 5 g of yeast is needed I'm guessing,  I would be tempted to double it to 100g of WW and deduct the extra 50g of WW and water in the levain from the autolyse and dump the commercial yeast altogether.

I see where you get the 40% whole grain if the total 120 g of rye of the dough flour is all whole rye instead of 20 g whole rye and 100g of rye (I'm guessing white rye) as the formula states.  It would be better a better tasting an more healthy bread in my book with double the levain, dropping the yeast and making the rye all whole rye getting to 40% whole grain aind 16% levain - which is probably the way I will make it after giving the original a shot.  Love that it is baked right out of the fridge, my favorite way to bake lately because of you, after only 8 hours in  retard - which means big blisters.  Will probably have to go for a longer retard with the all levain and no yeast changes.

I think I would go with a longer autolyse for the whole grains - 20 minutes isn't much for whole grains especially a 40% version.

The barley oat porridge bread from T3 looks great too.  So how much whole grains is in that?

This bread is getting pretty close to the top of the bake list but doubt that we can get the hokles you do.

Well done and happy baking Josh.  

golgi70's picture
golgi70

@ Franko - Could just be me but even with all the different variations I've thrown at this loaf it's always been just fantastic.  As stated this is maybe the best yet.  

 

@ dab Yes the recipe has come a little ways for me but I still give credit where its dues.  The original recipe calls for an 18 hour levain and some yeast to give it a bump.  it's also open crumbed and low profile without much bloom.  I never use anything but Fresh Milled Whole Rye.  Below is the formula I just used and matches up with much of what you said.  As for the holes.  Well I think that's in the shaping and using a the folding technique similar to Tartines will get you the same crumb I have.  its actually quite simple just takes a few tries to get the hang of.  In words.  after preshape and 30 minute rest turn out on lightly flour surface and without degassing make an oblong round like for most shaping.  Bring the bottom thrid carefull and quickly up 2/3 of the way.  Then stretch once side carefully outward and over the center and repeat with the other side (just like tartine).  Now bring the top right corn down to the center and give a gentle press.  Again with the left corner.  Should have some good tension now.  Now turn it over to create a seam and using  your table and a scraper give it a bit of tension.  Let sit on counter for a minute or two .  Dust top of loaf with flour and use your scraper to turn it into a floured bowl.  Done.  

The latest reincarnation I'll post for ya'll  Actually quite different I suppose but I think the best yet.  

 

 

Pane Maggiore (yet another maggiore with white and wheat levain)
------------

Wheat Levain (100% hydration) 
----------
16g    Seed Starter @ 80% hydration   (78% White, 20% Wheat, 2% Rye)
36g    H20
33.6g Wheat, freshly ground 
-----------
85.6g  (10% pre-fermented flour of total)

White Levain (100% hydration)
------------
17.12g    Seed @ 100% hydration  (95% White, 5% Rye)
34.2  Flour (95% White, 5% Rye)

34.2 H20

-------------
85.6 g (10% pre fermented flour of total


Dough:
-----------

-137.4g   Whole Wheat, freshly ground
-128.6     Whole Rye (fresh ground)
-504.4     Malted White Flour (11.5% protein) KA All Purpose would work here
658.8      H20  (hold back 10% for bassinage)
18.4        Sea Salt

-----------
Total Flour 856 (60 White, 23 Wheat, 17 Rye)
Total H20  744.4 (87%)
Total Dough 1618.8 (2 loaves @ 800 g)


1 hour autolyse (Hold Back 10% of the water)

Add Salt and mix to combine.  Develop dough to medium development.  Good signs of gluten but not fully mixed. 

Add 10% of held back water (warm) and mix until dough comes back together.  Place in greased container giving a stretch and fold.  

Bulk Ferment 4 hours:  4 Stretch and folds @ 40 minutes (elongate and fold like a letter then again from the opposite                                                                                               direction for each fold)

Divide and preshape into a round and let rest 30 minutes

Shape into batards or boules roll in flour and into a floured bowl. 

Retard 8-12 hours

Bake 500 with steam for 13 minutes and vented for 20-25 more. 

Josh

isand66's picture
isand66

These look great Josh.  Love the crust and crumb on these.

Regards

Ian

ml's picture
ml

Great looking bread & interesting changes to formula. I haven't had such good breads, so far, from T3. Mind sharing your whole process, including changes?

golgi70's picture
golgi70

Done 4 bakes from the book and all have been altered to some degree.  First and foremost the flour blend changed because I don't have any high extraction flour on hand.  Of the recipes I've tried the blend used 1/2 High Extraction and Half Bread Flour.  So following his recommended 50/50 wheat/white to sub for hi extraction it is all in all 75/25 white wheat.  I keep my own blend of 78/20/2 White/Wheat/Rye for my starter maintenance and just used this in place.  Other changes were just switching the grain in the porridge and using half of the suggested amount (increasing hydration a touch to balance).  I've actually found that most of the dough needed more water.  He mentions the bakery uses 5-10% more in these formulas but I suppose he wanted to keep it managable for the home baker.  I will be pushing the hydration in future attemps to at least 90%.  

I've found that the temps being warm are important otherwise the dough isn't quite there in his time frame.  I've been doing an hour with the autolyse  I also have waited an hour after the sixth fold for shaping.  He doesn't define how to combine the porridge well and I've found they don't fold in very well.  i think you actually need to carefully incorporate it in the dough but I've yet to try this.  

I feel like I'm rambling and maybe not helping.  Ask anything you want.  i think I'll try another bread tomorrow.  

Oh another thing the pictures actually look like small loaves but they are nearly three pound loaves or at least the variations I've tried.  So the recipes that call for 2 loaves I've been making into 3 smaller loaves

Josh

Mebake's picture
Mebake

They look spectacular, Josh! I love how well aerated the crumb looks; you have excellent command oevr fermentation. 

Khalid

CeciC's picture
CeciC

I wish i can bake a good looking loaf like yours. I bet they have superior taste as well.

wassisname's picture
wassisname

Those loaves look terrific, Josh.  The crumb on the barley loaf is just magic!  Looks like you've found a sweetspot for that formula.  Thanks for sharing.

Marcus

golgi70's picture
golgi70

@Mebake   Those are some kind words. Thanks.  I really enjoy seeing the breads you bake as well.  I assume pastry class is over.  What you been cooking/baking?

 

@Cecic -  You do and I've seen pictures to prove it.  Thanks for the kind words.

@Marcus -  Thanks.  I'm having fun using the ideas from T3.  What more to come.  

Josh