The Fresh Loaf

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Danish and Lithuanian Scalded Rye Breads

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breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Danish and Lithuanian Scalded Rye Breads

Hi everybody, especially rye bread enthusiasts...  Just wanted to post some things that I have been working on:

12/7/13 - Danish Rye Bread

This one turned out really well for winging it.  It's a mix of a bunch of stuff, freshly cracked rye, spelt, wheat berries, rye flour, pumpkin/flax/sesame seeds, old bread, rye sourdough, spelt stiff levain, barley malt syrup, blackstrap molasses.

12/11/13 - Lithuanian Scalded Rye Bread

This one was inspired by this video with Paul Hollywood of the Karaway Bakery in London: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2az4i_XP4Uc

http://karawaybakery.com/ourProducts/breads

and these blog posts: http://flourandleaven.wordpress.com/2013/05/02/lithuanian-scalded-rye/

http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/GreedyPiglet/the-dark-side-sourdough-scalded-rye-bread/

http://www.gourmantineblog.com/lithuanian-black-rye-bread/

and this page: http://ausis.gf.vu.lt/eka/food/bread.html

My attempt consisted of 95% rye flour, 5% AP flour, water, blackstrap molasses, barley malt, salt, caraway seeds.

Here is a photo of the nice side of the loaf.  I think it could have been proofed a little longer...  I will cut into it tomorrow to see what it looks like.  From the good side, it looks pretty good...

12/13/13 - Crumbshots and Breakfast

Until the next loaf...

Tim

Comments

Song Of The Baker's picture
Song Of The Baker

Excellent loaves of some of my favourite types of breads. Nicely done.  May I ask what those light brown coloured cheese slices you have there by the lighter Swiss/Gruyere?  If they are even cheese...

John

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Thanks!  The light brown cheese is "gjetost" which is a Norwegian goat cheese that I actually learned to eat on a trip to Iceland...  I've always seen it at our local market but had no idea what it was...  It is actually made with caremelised goat milk...  If you can find it where you are, it's worth a try.  It's like cheese candy...

Tim

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Tim,

These loaves look really nice.  I have been experimenting with similar types of loaves and am enjoying baking them.  Mind sharing how you have been baking them?  Temps and times?  That is the one piece that I am still toying around with….

Janet

breadsong's picture
breadsong

Hi Tim,
I'm with Janet, very curious about the bake profile.
Very beautiful loaves, and thanks for the links.
:^) breadsong

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Thanks.  Just cut it open, took some photos and had breakfast...  It's not bad, but I'm going to give some of it to my Lithuanian friend to see what she thinks...  I think there could have been more caraway seeds, but I ran out so I used what was left...  I'll post my process when I'm up to it.  It's pretty involved...

Tim

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

Hi Tim,

I watched the video links and I am comfortable with the process as that is how I make a lot of my rye breads - I follow Andy's method as outlined for his Borodinsky - the piece I am most interested in is  baking times and temps.  His are loooong and I am trying to find a way to shorted them with my home oven that produces a crumb that is cooked all the way t through and doesn't gum up the knife when cut into….I have a method that works - almost - so am looking for how others achieve their results.

Thanks,

Janet

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Hi Janet,

For the Danish rye bread, there was 2kg of dough into a 13 x 4 x 4 pullman pan.  That baked at 400F for 30 minutes with the lid, then 375F for another 90 minutes without the lid...

For the Lithuanian rye bread, It was almost 2kg of dough into a 9 x 4 x 4 pullman pan.  I baked at 450F for 10 minutes with steam, then for another 85 minutes at 400F-375F, then another 10 minutes out of the pan in an off oven.

Both loaves were also baked on the 2nd to bottom rack with a baking stone.  Both loaves were fully cooled, then wrapped in a towel for 24 hours before slicing...  Also, I made sure that my internal temp was around 205F to 210F and that the weight loss was at least 15% after baking from the final dough weight. 

I think the resting period is very important.  In my experience, after 24hrs, it's sliceable but your knife will get a little gummy.  After 48 hours, slicing is easier.  The Danish rye slices easier after being wrapped in plastic wrap and refrigerated overnight.  I use a very sharp chef's knife to slice.  Don't bother with a serrated bread knife...

Hope this helps.

Tim

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

Love these loaves especially with all the hearty add ins.  Well done and

Happy Baking

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

I backed up the page and copied my reply before it tried to disappear again,  then edited the single title line.  It happened when I didn't fill in the "Subject" box.  If you're careful you can back up to it, it might not be lost.

The ryes look great!  You sure that isn't one hunk of a brownie?  Yum!

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

I can assure you that none of them are brownies...  There are only 3 slices of the Danish rye bread left...  I'll have to make some more...

Tim

MisterTT's picture
MisterTT

was a long one as well :)

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

from MisterTT

Hi, Tim!

Some nice looking loaves! I'm on the hunt for the sort of bread tins that you have, but having trouble finding some. Did you order them online?

If I may, though, a slight critique -- aimed not at you, but at the Karaway bakery -- I'm Lithuanian and have been living in Lithuania all my life and you would never find the sort of bread that this bakery calls "Lithuanian" rye. I have never ever even seen or heard of such a thing as molasses (blackstrap or any other sort) being put in bread, because, frankly, there is no molasses in Lithuania -- nobody sells it, nobody uses it (I know for a fact that it is not used in bread). Also, barley malt would only be used to brew beer, the malt that gets put in rye bread is always a rye malt -- usually roasted rye malt with no enzyme activity, though occasionally you may come across russian style red rye malt.

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

My pans are the pullman pans from USA Pans.  I have both the 13" x 4" x 4" and the 9" x 4" x 4" pans.  They are available online at Amazon.com, King Arthur Flour, and other online retailers.  Also browncookie.com has a 4.5" x 4.5" x 4.5" mini pullman pan with lid.

As far as your critique, the Karaway Bakery is using rye malt, and rye malt syrup in their bread according to YouTube video.  As you can guess, I am not Lithuanian, or Russian, so it's difficult for me to find information about these bread as much of the writing on these types of bread are not in English.

Regarding the rye malt syrup, in Andrew Whitley's book Bread Matters, for his Borodinsky bread recipe, he mentions substituting "suslo" the rye malt syrup with a mix of blackstrap molasses and barley malt, both of which I have easier access to.

If you could point me to more information regarding Lithuanian breads, that would be great as I have only found a few sources in English, none of which are extensive...  Thanks.

Tim

breadsong's picture
breadsong

Hi Tim,
Became of a rye malt syrup awhile ago - here's a link, in case this product is of interest to you for your bread-making:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/northern-brewer-rye-malt-syrup.html

:^) breadsong

 

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Thanks.  I saw that link yesterday.  I may get around to ordering some shortly.  Or, I'm going to check out some brewing supply shops in Brooklyn to see what I can find.

Tim

varda's picture
varda

Not winging it.   Improv.  -Varda

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

I didn't do it!  Promise...  Hopefully this will be resolved soon...

Tim

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

and got the rest of the post!  It was hidden!  ...interesting   (wonder how that happens?)  (are we hijacking this post?)

Mini

Varda, have you been passed the "magic wand?"

Mebake's picture
Mebake

Those look great, Tim!

 

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Thanks Khalid!

nicodvb's picture
nicodvb

that I haven't made 100% rye bread for a while. Thanks for reminding me what matters in the kitchen, Tim!:)

I love those breads, they look amazing. Lithuanian scalded rye is a beast that I haven't tamed yet. I prepared it several times, but so far I always ended up with a crumbly crumb, that is not surprising. Very tasty, but I'd like some more structure.

  Nico

breadbakingbassplayer's picture
breadbakingbass...

Thanks Nico!  I've been playing around with high percentage rye breads lately with a few spelt brioches thrown in there just to have some variety and practice...

I'm happy that they turned out, especially the Lithuanian one as I'm only making guesses as to the process and recipe from what I can piece together on the internet.  My Lithuanian friend said it was "perfect" so I guess I can start refining this recipe...

As for structure, I did use 5% AP flour to make a liquid levain for the rye scald.  I was reading on the internet and found this link: http://stason.org/TULARC/food/sourdough-recipes/211-Notes-on-Russian-Sourdough-Bread.html#.Uq4acfaH9q4

There it says that borodinsky can be 85% Rye/15% Wheat flour.  That should help with the structure a bit...

Tim