The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

KNEADING- Bertinet vs. Lepard

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gretel's picture
gretel

KNEADING- Bertinet vs. Lepard

Hi ,

 

What do most of you do for your serious or small bakery kneading- the slap down, time consuimg, effort-required, impressive show of the Bertinet clan or the ever-so gentle, passive and sweet method of oil the board, barely touch the bread and let it rest and repeat this many times of Dan Lepard?

I have done a Milk Loaf by Lepard which turned out fabulous but some of his breads which I want to do literally require a whole day at home- you start at 8am and then don't bake this until 5:30 at night. You can not leave the house as every 30 min. about you must go lightly touch the rising dough.

 

 

rafaelbata's picture
rafaelbata

Try to combine both, mix with a stand mixer or do the Bertinet for a few minutes, until the ingredients are well mixed than do the stretch and fold (3 times should be enough in a one and half hour span), then let it rest on a bulk fermentation when you are ready to shape.

My last two weeks I was in a aprenticeship program in an artisanal bakery. Some breads were mixed in the afternoon to be baked in the morning (these used more stretch and fold then mixing on the mixer), and those bread mixed on the morning to be baked on the same day had the mixer do all the work (develop the gluten on the mixer).

gretel's picture
gretel

Interesting, thanks. But what is "bulk fermentation?"

Also, does mixing with the mixer vs hand kneading over heat the dough at times? In an ideal world where you had all the time you needed, would you say the multiple hand knead and rest periods method produces better bread or do you think they produce a similar product?

metlboy's picture
metlboy

While a stand mixer is more likely to overheat the dough than hand mixing, overheating would indicate that you're doing it wrong. It's also possible to use a stand mixer to just incorporate the ingredients (maybe 3 minutes on a low speed, 45 seconds to 1 minute on high), and then do 2 or 3 hand stretch and folds from there. With such a small time at high speed, there's no chance of overheating.

gretel's picture
gretel

The idea to just use the mixer to incorporate first and then rest and knead briefly sounds great. But I thought that if a recipe says hand knead for 8 minutes, I am to assume that I would use the mixer on medium for 7-8 minutes total to get the bread to the same point. This is what I have gathered from reading, that it is almost the same amount of time in the mixer as for hand kneading. Maybe a person would want to rest the motor after 4 minutes then start again, but I thought I need to use the mixer for 8 minutes if I don't hand knead. Please be me know if this is not right as I will be baking bread Sat morning with this 6 day starter. I appreciate it.