The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Whole grain

  • Pin It
Aideuis's picture
Aideuis

Whole grain

Here is a pic of my whole grain bread that I have been working on.  It is 100% organic whole wheat flour and sprouted whole wheat flour (about 6%).  It is a yeasted bread that was fermented around 12 hours.  The flavor is good but could be better.  I am trying to work on naturally leavened breads for their improved flavor and keeping qualities and would like to get rid of my addiction to commercial yeast.  I am struggling with how much starter to use for my current formulas.  How much rye starter, 100% hydration, fed on 24 hour cycle do I add to 128oz of flour to achieve a 12 hr bulk ferment at 75 F and what should my beginning dough temp be?  Or  what percentage of starter do I need to add to my curent formulas to get a 12 hr bulk ferment(please include room temp)? Some of my breads use a 2 build epoxy method, but I do not want to go from starter, to leaven, to dough.  I just want to pich my starter like I do the commercial yeast.

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

I can not give you a specific amount because I ferment my 100% whole grain doughs in my refrigerator at a much lower temperature. For my doughs I generally use 15% pre fermented flour at 75% hydration only and they are left in bulk form for approx 12 hours in the refrig.  (approx. 45°) after  2- 3 hour room temp. bulk (70-75° this time of year)  right after mixing.  In the morning the dough is given another couple of hours at room temp. before shaping and proofing. (This method is one I learned from following txfarmer's 100% whole wheat sourdough recipes that you can do a search for using the search box above.)

My guess is that you would have to use way less - like maybe 5% pre fermented flour only due to the temps you have specified.  When using whole grains 75° is quite warm and things move quickly resulting in over proofing and dough break down due to all of the enzymes.

Best way to find out is to experiment starting with maybe 5% and seeing what happens.  If it is too slow move your pre fermented flour up an notch or two until you hit on an amount that works for you.  There really is no 'right' way.....just what works in your kitchen/home and on your schedule so that you can bake breads that you enjoy....my opinion only.  I am not a professional :-)

Have fun!

Janet

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

so a build is inevitable to increase the yeast numbers.  You are looking for a table.  Temp and amount of rye starter to inoculate a given amount of flour.  Is that 128oz (3630g) of "flour" specific?  You will find that fermentation varies with type of flour.  The dough hydration will also affect the fermentation.  Is it also 100% hydration?  The timing of your starter makes a difference.  I would also be feeding the rye starter a little wheat flour as well if no rye is included in the recipe.  Just off hand a ratio of 1:5:5 jumps to mind with 80°F water temp and 75°F flour temp.  Try it on a small scale first.  

Aideuis's picture
Aideuis

Thank you for the advice, I have been chilling my water for mixing to 40 F and flour temp has been around 73 F, I will give the 5% starter a try and see if it works out.  Right now my whole grain is around 80% hydration, does any one think this will work or have you tried such a schedule?  Thanks.

Janetcook's picture
Janetcook

80% is pretty wet and fermenting happens more quickly when there is more liquid for the yeast to use....so I would suggest lowering to about 65% but there are a lot of factors you have to take into consideration as you are probably seeing - like the temp of your dough.  

I would still suggest picking a pre ferment amount,  a hydration amount and temp. then try it out so you have a 'base' from which to work.  If it ferments too quickly then you can change one thing at a time in your formula until you get the results you are looking for.  Change too many things and you will never know what the deciding factor is...gets too confusing.

Good Luck!

Janet

 

Grenage's picture
Grenage

I've never had much fun working with wholemeal below 75%, as the flour absorbs so much liquid!

HeidiH's picture
HeidiH

Wow!  I've never seen a whole grain bread that open.  Wow!  Just WOW!

Yerffej's picture
Yerffej

 "It is 100% organic whole wheat flour..."

I am curious as to exactly which flour you are using.

Jeff

Aideuis's picture
Aideuis

It is a organic whole wheat flour milled at one of the many subsidiary mills for King Arthur.

Yerffej's picture
Yerffej

Is it labeled as Organic KA Whole Wheat Flour?

Aideuis's picture
Aideuis

Thanks, the loaf did get more dense through the center, but I was shocked as well when I cut 3 out of 12 they all looked consistent and open.  Not quite good enough though...