The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

Silicone Loaf Pans

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aytab's picture
aytab

Silicone Loaf Pans

My wife recently brought home two silicone loaf pans from our local restaurant supply store as well as a silicone Bundy Cake Pan. I haven't used the Bundt Cake pan yet. I have treid to use the loaf pans though on three different occassions. All three times I have tried the loaves collapsed. I don't have this problem with my metal pans. The loaves rise fine but as soon as I move the cookie sheet, they are sitting on, to put them in the oven they just start going flat. I am thinking that even though they are on a rigid surface the sides are just to flexible and this allows the loaves to flex releasing the gas inside. Which is causing the loaves to deflate. Any suggestions, other than to stop using the darn things? I do like them in that the bread just pops right out of them and never ever sticks, but what good is that when I'm popping out a brick. Any suggestions or help would be greatly appreciated. Also, due to the problems I'm having with the loaf pans, I'm afraid to even try the Bundt Cake Pan and have just continued to use my metal ones. Oh and one more thing I have tried two simple White Sandwich Bread recipes and one English Muffin Bread recipe.

Mini Oven's picture
Mini Oven

also check discussions in the archives on: silicone pans    

I prefer my metal pans.  They keep their shape.  

I could never get the middle of the bundt pan to bake thoroughly in a silicone form.   

pjaj's picture
pjaj

I bought a 2lb silicon pan some time ago and also got poor results.

The sides bulged slightly under the weight of the dough and gave an odd shaped loaf.

It did release easily, but so do my annodised aluminium pans if lightly oiled.

The bread took significantly longer to cook (10 minutes more) than an identical quantity of  dough in the aluminimum pans in the same oven at the same time. Silicon is an insulator!!

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

rated safe to use to a max 456 F too.  That goes for most all silicone bakeware made here and abroad.  I routinely bake at 500 F.  You can buy at least 1 of them every week at Goodwill for no more than a dollar.  I have no sticking with my tins or pyrex since I spray them with PAM substitute anyway j- ust to make sure they never stick.

BoyntonStu's picture
BoyntonStu

You might want to copy this design:

 

Adjustable non-stick Bread Pan Invention

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmU3Uflp5K8

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

BoyntonaStu.  I see you have 45 videos total.  Are they all on bread?  Where do you buy sheets of teflon rated to 475F ?

BoyntonStu's picture
BoyntonStu

to 450* F

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Silicone-cooking-sheet-tray-pan-baking-mat-liner-1-mm-/220805365130?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3369067d8a#ht_2026wt_1140

 

to 482*F

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SILPAT-SILICONE-NONSTICK-BAKING-SHEET-MAT-11-5-8-x16-1-2-WORKS-GREAT-NEW-/180810616085?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a19270d15#ht_2227wt_1094

 

This should do it.

http://www.lionsdeal.com/wi-sbs-24.html?utm_source=[nextag]&utm_medium=comparisonshopping&utm_term=WINCO&utm_campaign=Kitchen,Baking%20Supplies,Baking%20Mats&utm_content=wi-sbs-24

Silicone Baking Mats Fits Full-size Sheet Pan 16 x 24
(1 review)


Product Code: wi-sbs-24Questions about this Product?
 
   
$17.86Reg. price: $28.97
Savings: $11.11 (38%)
Order Qty: Earn 18 Rewards Points for this item! Learn More...Earn Double Rewards Points thru 03/22/2012!
DescriptionSilicone Baking Mat, 16-3/8"x24 1/2", Fits Full-size Sheet Pan. Discover what were once only found in the professional kitchen: silicone baking mats. Oven safe up to 475 degrees and totally non-stick, these silicone baking mats last for more than 1000 uses (instead of parchment paper or wax paper). Try baking something with cheese on a regular baking pan. On the silicone baking mat, it will easily lift off with a spatula with no need to chisel. Bake cookies without having to grease the pan. Typically $25 or more, silicone baking mats were the purview of chef's kitchens, now they are becoming staples of home kitchens as well.

 

Note*  I could not fnd my sheet(s).  I have 2 different brands.

Both are very thin and I have had both up to 475 *F many times.

They are 4 or 5 years old.

aloomis's picture
aloomis

I have several of those silicone mats.  They aren't flexible enough for what you do.  They're pretty thick and shouldn't be folded (they contain a fiberglass mesh).  I think the concern with teflon is offgassing, but I think you need to get to 750F or so for that to be an issue.  

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

There is no Teflon in silicone sheets like Silpat a registered trademark of a French company.   My half sheet one is good up to 482 F according to its spec sheet that came with it and it cost $25.  I haven't used it for bread since it isn't rated to 500F. But will try it out on some bread to be cooked at 450 F  and pre heat at that temperature.

As a side note, the US government, EPA, has filed suit againstt Dow Chemical has been thinking about banning Teflon coated pans in the USA for some time now.  One  - they break down and off gas at lower temperatures somewhere around 396 F with nothing in the pan - easy to do on a gas or electric range.  The gas causes birth defects and 'telfon flu'.  Plus - they only last a couple of years in my house and they never ever have any metal utensils in them ever.  I have switched back to cast iron for my non stick cooking since it never ever has to be replaced, nothing sticks to it if seasoned properly and it is much, much cheaper.   You can also use it against unwanted and uninvited intruders who wish you harm without killing them outright like you would with a gun if you shot them in the head instead.   I just love multi use cooking gear. 

BoyntonStu's picture
BoyntonStu

Sorry, I had a brain yeast hiccup!

 

We use TEFLON not Silicone

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-LARGE-Teflon-Oven-or-Pan-Liner-Baking-Mat-17-x-25-/310386740210?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item48447dcbf2#ht_2445wt_1124

2 LARGE Teflon Oven or Pan Liner Baking Mat 17" x 25"

 

  • 2 PCS LARGE Teflon Liners included in this offer.
  • Line your Ovens, baking pans or trays with this non stick and easy to clean Teflon.
  • It takes heat up to 500 degrees F.
  • Size of each pcs : 17" x 25"
  • Never have to scrub burned pans again! With Teflon you can simply wipe clean or rinse!
BoyntonStu's picture
BoyntonStu

http://www2.dupont.com/Teflon/en_US/products/safety/key_questions.html#q1

4.    What happens if nonstick coated cookware is overheated? 
At high temperatures, the quality of the coating may begin to deteriorate — it may discolor or lose its nonstick quality. This can begin to occur at temperatures above 500°F (260°C). If heated to an extremely high temperature, the coating may begin to decompose and give off fumes. Fats, butter, or cooking oil will begin to scorch and smoke at about 400°F (204°C). DuPont nonstick coatings will not begin to significantly decompose until temperatures exceed about 660°F (349°C) — well above the smoke point for cooking oil, fats or butter. It is therefore unlikely that decomposition temperatures for nonstick cookware would be reached while cooking without burning food to an inedible state.
dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

on which their lawsuit is based, show that Teflon begins outgassing at 396 F and not when the the company claims it does?   Guess the lawsuit has no merit because the company says so?  Guess the courts will decide?  I still use the stuff for eggs and crepes.

BoyntonStu's picture
BoyntonStu

http://www.ewg.org/reports/toxicteflon

I consider this test objective.

Also, we bake in an oven which never gets above its set temperature, like a frying pan, etc.

I fear not.

 

 

Canaries in the Kitchen: Teflon Toxicosis


PFOA / Teflon / Scotchgard
Teflon/Scotchgard (PFCs)EWG finds heated Teflon pans can turn toxic faster than DuPont claims

In two to five minutes on a conventional stovetop, cookware coated with Teflon and other non-stick surfaces can exceed temperatures at which the coating breaks apart and emits toxic particles and gases linked to hundreds, perhaps thousands, of pet bird deaths and an unknown number of human illnesses each year, according to tests commissioned by Environmental Working Group (EWG).

In new tests conducted by a university food safety professor, a generic non-stick frying pan preheated on a conventional, electric stovetop burner reached 736°F in three minutes and 20 seconds, with temperatures still rising when the tests were terminated. A Teflon pan reached 721°F in just five minutes under the same test conditions (See Figure 1), as measured by a commercially available infrared thermometer. DuPont studies show that the Teflon offgases toxic particulates at 464°F. At 680°F Teflon pans release at least six toxic gases, including two carcinogens, two global pollutants, and MFA, a chemical lethal to humans at low doses. At temperatures that DuPont scientists claim are reached on stovetop drip pans (1000°F), non-stick coatings break down to a chemical warfare agent known as PFIB, and a chemical analog of the WWII nerve gas phosgene.

For the past fifty years DuPont has claimed that their Teflon coatings do not emit hazardous chemicals through normal use. In a recent press release, DuPont wrote that "significant decomposition of the coating will occur only when temperatures exceed about 660 degrees F (340 degrees C). These temperatures alone are well above the normal cooking range."

These new tests show that cookware exceeds these temperatures and turns toxic through the common act of preheating a pan, on a burner set on high.

In cases of "Teflon toxicosis," as the bird poisonings are called, the lungs of exposed birds hemorrhage and fill with fluid, leading to suffocation. DuPont acknowledges that the fumes can also sicken people, a condition called "polymer fume fever." DuPont has never studied the incidence of the fever among users of the billions of non-stick pots and pans sold around the world. Neither has the company studied the long-term effects from the sickness, or the extent to which Teflon exposures lead to human illnesses believed erroneously to be the common flu.

The government has not assessed the safety of non-stick cookware. According to a Food and Drug Administration (FDA) food safety scientist: "You won't find a regulation anywhere on the books that specifically addresses cookwares," although the FDA approved Teflon for contact with food in 1960 based on a food frying study that found higher levels of Teflon chemicals in hamburger cooked on heat-aged and old pans. At the time, FDA judged these levels to be of little health significance.

Of the 6.9 million bird-owning households in the US that claim an estimated 19 million pet birds, many don't know know that Teflon poses an acute hazard to birds. Most non-stick cookware carries no warning label. DuPont publicly acknowledges that Teflon can kill birds, but the company-produced public service brochure on bird safety discusses the hazards of ceiling fans, mirrors, toilets, and cats before mentioning the dangers of Teflon fumes.

As a result of the new data showing that non-stick surfaces reach toxic temperatures in a matter of minutes, EWG has petitioned the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) to require that cookware and heated appliances bearing non-stick coatings must carry a label warning of the acute hazard the coating poses to pet birds. Additionally, we recommend that bird owners completely avoid cookware and heated appliances with non-stick coatings. Alternative cookware includes stainless steel and cast iron, neither of which offgases persistent pollutants that kill birds.

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

I sighted.  I'm glad you are OK with it.  Me too.  The EWG - Environmental Working Group is a subset, a legal part of the EPA.  The tests that they conducted in Missouri showed outgassing of teflon that killed birds at 396 F. Click on the thermometer at the right of the article that says Teflon Can't Stand the Heat. You will notice the bird deaths in Missouri at 396 F degrees. 

Also, 'DuPont acknowledges that the fumes can also sicken people, a condition called "polymer fume fever." DuPont has never studied the incidence of the fever among users of the billions of non-stick pots and pans sold around the world. '

Well, neither has the federal government FDA, EPA or Center For Disease control conducted such studies since all are complicit in approving a deadly pan coating in 1960 without doing the proper studies - that others have finally done - now.  'Polymer fume fever', in this study that was done nearly 10 years ago, is now called 'Teflon Flu.'   Not said, is that Dupont and the Federal government also aknowledge today that Teflon can cause birth defects in humans at much lower temperatures than first claimed by Dupont and the government.  Imagine that!

Nothing changes does it?

suave's picture
suave

"WWII nerve gas phosgene" I can not help but ask authors - you have the audacity to call yourself chemist?  Scientists?  Dude, where'd that "Ph.D" come from?

aytab's picture
aytab

Hey I didn't want to get into a discussion over teflon safety and trust me just about the last group of people I want to talk about is the EPA, nor do I wnat to discuss lawsuits etc. I was merely trying to find out if anyone else had had problems using silicone loaf pans and what if anything they did to solve the problems, or did they just stop using them. I have plenty of metal pans I can use just thought there might be some tricks to these silicone things. Please if you want to talk lawsuits, toxic gasses and the like, create another thread, because quite honestly if I was worried about lawsuits and toxic gasses I wouldn't live in Los Angeles and I wouldn't own an 85 pound bulldog. Now does anybody have any tricks for using these dang silicone pans?

suave's picture
suave

Yes, you take silicon pan and put it inside a metal pan.

aytab's picture
aytab

Thank you Suave, now there's a truly helpful tip.

suave's picture
suave

I think it was CI people who came up with this suggestion after experiencing the same problem in their tests. 

Wild-Yeast's picture
Wild-Yeast

I am a No-Pan Skeptic intended...

Wild-Yeast