The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

White Sandwich Loaf

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Syd's picture
Syd

White Sandwich Loaf


Poolish

250g all purpose flour
250g water
1/16 - 1/8 of a tsp yeast (more if it is cold, less if it is hot)

Mix together and leave for 12 hours.

Dough

300g white bread flour 
130g milk (scalded)
unsalted butter 6g
10g salt
3g instant yeast
a little less than 1/4 tsp of ascorbic acid


[Hydration = 69%]

Scald milk and add butter and salt to it. Stir until dissolved. Allow milk to cool to room temp.  Add to poolish, then add dry ingredients.

Knead for 5mins - rest for 5mins - knead for 5mins. Allow to proof until doubled. A stretch and fold half way through fermentation is necessary not so much for gluten strength, as it is to degas the dough.  Pre-shape. Shape and put into a two pound tin. Let it rise until coming about an inch over the top of the tin. (My tin is a 10x19x11cm 900g loaf tin).

Bake at 230 C with steam for 15 mins and without steam at 190 C for 35 mins. Remove from tin for last 10 mins .


 



This loaf has a crisp crust and a tender, moist crumb.  It toasts very evenly and makes a good sandwich.  It keeps well, too.


Syd


 

Comments

MarieH's picture
MarieH

This bread reminds me of the main bread my mom made when I was a child. Mom was a wonderful baker and we never had store-bought baked goods of any kind. I know now how lucky I was! Thanks for the memory...

Mary Fisher's picture
Mary Fisher

Seeing your comment reminded me of my first bread-baking experience, in the mid 1940s.


My mother put a lot of flour (probably two 3lb bags) with some salt into a pancheon on the hearthrug and placed cubes of lard round the edges. She'd dissolved the yeast in warm water and when it foamed poured it into a well in the flour. More water waw added and she mixed it into the flour with her hand. Gradually the flour became incorporated, as did the lard. She explained that when the dough left the pancheon clean it was ready to rise and could be covered with a towel and left in front of the coal fire. 


Eventually the towel would lift up, showing that the dough had risen. It was then 'knocked back', shaped and put into bread tins. When it had risen above the height of the tin it was put into the oven at the side of the fire, except for some dough left behind deliberately and rolled flat to make an 'oven bottomer'. That was my very favourite loaf, warm, with margarine (no butter, rationed) and golden syrup. Bliss.


A LOT of perfect loaves were made at a time but there was no recipe, my mother, as I do, used her rule of thumb and experience. But in those days it was always plain white bread, what I suppose Americans would call 'sandwich bread'/


She taught me to knead and knock back and fill the tins, I've been making bread ever since. A long time. One day, I keep promising myself, I'll clean the pancheon and make 'Mother's Bread', with lard. But I'll use butter on the oven bottomer!


Mary

Syd's picture
Syd

That's a lovely story, Mary.  Was that Lyle's Golden Syrup by any chance?  You taught me a new word: pancheon!


regards


Syd

Mary Fisher's picture
Mary Fisher

Yes, Syd, it was Lyles - or was it Tate & Lyles - can't remember when it changed. The tin still has the lion with bees on the front.


Having kept bees for maany years I now know that a swarm would never settle in such a place but don't tell Lyle's, if they changed the front of the tin my life would be changed irrevocably.


We still use it, Spouse likes it on peanut butter on butter on bread. Any kind of bread. Infuriatingly he stays at 9 stones something. Grrrrrr.


We'll be using it with lemon juice next Tuesday of course. The year is marked by seasonal specialities, we never have pancakes at other times. That way, when we do it's very special. I wouldn't be surprised if 'children' and grandchildren just happen to be passing ...


Mary

Syd's picture
Syd

"Out of the strong came forth sweetness" or something to that effect.  It was a biblical story anyway.  Something about Samson killing a lion only to find later that a swarm of  bees had settled in the carcass whereupon he harvested the honey.  My mom used to make a steamed pudding which had Lyles Golden Syrup in it.  She served it with hot custard.  It was delicious. :)


Syd

Mary Fisher's picture
Mary Fisher

Yes, I didn't want to go into details. Not that I remember his harvesting honey ... he just tasted it. It became the subject of a riddle for the Philistines to answer. "Out of the eater came something to eat, out of the strong came forth sweetness." Judges 14. It came to a bad end though, Sampson was strong in the arm but not so much in the head ...

'Treacle' pudding is indeed delicious but we never have it now, far too many calories! I looked on the tin today, it is still Lyle's but a trademark of Tate & Lyle.

Amori's picture
Amori

Tall and handsome loaf, saved in my to-do list.

varda's picture
varda

for whenever I'm done with my current bread obsessions.   Pan loaves rarely look so enticing.  -Varda

teketeke's picture
teketeke

It is absolutely great looking loaf, Syd!


Akiko

breadsong's picture
breadsong

Hello, I enjoyed seeing both of your successes with your tall sandwich loaves!

from breadsong


 

Syd's picture
Syd

Thanks, breadsong. :)  This one has been a standard of mine for a while now.  Have a good weekend!


Syd

wally's picture
wally

And I like the poolish - I'll bet you've got some nice flavor that wouldn't have been there otherwise.


Nice bake,


Larry

caraway's picture
caraway

to try this beautiful loaf.  Thank you for posting the recipe!


Sue

SylviaH's picture
SylviaH

Like Wally, I like your poolish addition!


Sylvia

Mebake's picture
Mebake

Beautiful, Syd! Well done!!

Syd's picture
Syd

Thank you all for your kind comments. 


The height on this loaf comes from my baking pans which are lovely and tall.  The only drawback is that the slices don't fit into my toaster.


The poolish contributes both to the flavour and the improved keeping quality of the loaf.  Without the poolish this loaf would just be ordinary.  It can be eaten fresh for at least two days and makes great toast after that.  (The vitamin C also improves the keeping quality).  You could get away with less yeast in the final dough (say 2g or even 1g) and just extend the bulk fermentation.  This would squeeze even more flavour out of it.  I have retarded it overnight, but if you do this, retard soon after final shaping or else it might over rise in the fridge (particularly if you use the larger amount of yeast).


Best,


Syd

louie brown's picture
louie brown

and this loaf looks great. Like the others, I agree that the poolish makes sense. It's always useful to have a loaf like this in the cache.

Frequent Flyer's picture
Frequent Flyer

My neighbor asked for a white sandwich loaf this weekend, so I through together a poolish yesterday (85% the size of your poolish)- without having a recipe in mind.  It's in the fridge now and needs to be used.  Your recipe is perfect to scale down some. 


Thanks


FF


 

Syd's picture
Syd

You're welcome! :)


Syd

Aren's picture
Aren

I decided to try this bread, and I've been having a few problems. So far I've made it twice, and both times it stays small and a little dense. It also stays pale. The bread has a great taste, though, so my roommates don't mind it's flaws =)


Any idea what could be causing this? I've followed the directions...

Syd's picture
Syd

Tell me a little more about how you make the bread.  What yeast are you using?  How hot was the milk when you added it?  Do you have a thermometer?  How long did the whole process take?  Include some pics if you can.  It will be much easier for me to make a diagnosis if you do.


To scald milk, heat it to 185F or 85C.  Allow it to return to room temp before using.  If you pour scalded milk onto yeast, it will be sure to kill it.  Check your yeast.  Is it fresh?  Sometimes, it might not even be past its sell by date but it is still ineffective.  (It might have been stored incorrectly and  perished).  If in doubt, throw it out and buy some more. 


What was the room temperature where you left it to rise?


Was the poolish full of little bubbles before you used it?  It shouldn't have risen and collapsed.  (A 'high water mark" on your bowl will be evidence of this).  Search for pictures on this site of what a ripe poolish should look like. 


What flour did you use?


The fact that it was pale indicates that your whole process took too long and all the fermentable sugars were used up leaving nothing to give the crust colour when you baked it. 


Take photos of each stage of the process and post them. Include details of temperature and time.  These will all help to give a more accurate diagnosis.


best,


Syd

Aren's picture
Aren

That's what I was thinking too, but I just let it sit long enough to rise. My poolish was ful of bubles, and it had risen nicely. I let it sit out overnight (about 11 hours) and it looked great. I used a white bread flour. I also allowed my milk reach about room temperature before adding it to anything. I'll be sure to take pictures the next time I make it!


The only difference I see is that I'm using active dry yeast instead of instant. Would that cause my problems?


Thanks for all your help!

Syd's picture
Syd


The only difference I see is that I'm using active dry yeast instead of instant. Would that cause my problems?



If you are using active dry yeast, increase your yeast to about 4g or even 5g and sprinkle it on top of the warm (approx. 35 degree C) milk to let it activate.  No need to stir.  Just sprinkle.  It should dissolve and start to get a bit frothy (about 5 to 10 mins).  Now use it. 


Look forward to seeing the pictures.


Syd

Aren's picture
Aren

Ok, I'll try that! I was planning on starting a loaf tonight!

Aren's picture
Aren

Ok, here it is! I got a much better rise this time, and it's still a little pale, though not as pale as it was before. It tastes great, though! I decided to go for a little bit of a chewier loaf, so I substituted water for the milk. 


Syd's picture
Syd

Well you certainly had no problem with the rising this time.  Looks good.  The crust could be darker, though.  Not sure why you aren't getting a darker crust.  It could be that your oven is not getting hot enough.  How long do you pre-heat your oven for?  Start off with a higher temperature and then turn down to a lower temperature.  If all else fails, you could sneak some sugar into the recipe.  That will brown it.


Keep on working at it until you are satisfied.


All the best,


Syd

teketeke's picture
teketeke

Hello, Syd and Aren


Syd, Your loaf absolutely looking great and moist. I like the idea of non sugar in the dough. I will put it in my baking list :)


Aren, your loaf reminds me of the baguette that I made before. It was pale like yours.  Then I realized that I used Arrowhead flour doesn't contain any malt powder at all.  Usually most of flour contain malt powder. That is why the baguette looked very pale even I baked it at higher temeperature.   It will be darker when you use Arthur King flour that is yellowish flour to compare to other regular flour.


As Syd wrote, You might be solved when you add some sugar in it next time.


Cheers,


Akiko

Syd's picture
Syd

Thanks, Akiko.  Actually, when I first started working on this loaf I put in a little sugar, but someone advised me that it wasn't necessary and ever since I haven't added any.  It is not as fine crumbed as the Asian Pain de Mie (it doesn't have a lot of shortening, neither is it intensively kneaded, but it is moist, has a lovely flavour and keeps well.  You are probably right: Aren's flour might not be malted.  If that is the case, he could add malt to it or some sugar.


Best,


Syd

teketeke's picture
teketeke

Hi, Syd


I made your loaf today. I used KAAp and KA bread flour.  What kind of flour do you use?  I felt that it was little too wet. My culculator is wrong, may be. Sometimes it happens. However, It is very tasty and moist and evenly toasted as well as you discribe. Thank you for sharing your wonderful loaf, Syd.



----


Oops, Not calculater,,, SCALE is right.  My scale is not reliable. I bought other one, but I returned it because it was worse than the one that I have.  I again forgot to log out my son's ( R.cubebaker).  Sorry... I am messing up other TFL members post like this... I better be careful.. I am sorry, Syd.


Best wishes,


Akiko

Syd's picture
Syd

Beautiful, Akiko!  That's a perfect result! 


I use bread flour but it is only 11.5% protein so it is not very strong.  I am not sure how that compares to KAAP.  What is the protein content of KAAP?  Did you have to add a lot of flour? 


Thanks for posting, Akiko. :)


Syd

teketeke's picture
teketeke

King Arthur unbleached all purpose flour's protein is 11.7% and the bread flour's protein is 12.7%.   This is my fault, Syd. The other loaf was kind of wetter than usual today.  When I looked up my scale carelly, the plate was not horizontal because the screw that ajust the balance of the plate was slightly loose today. It happens sometimes.  I usually notice it when the plate is really inclined.


My daughter loved your loaf. She asked me more and  more.. :)  I like to taste the sweetness that is produced from flour and liquid. YUM!


Thank you, too! Syd!!


Akiko

R.cubebaker's picture
R.cubebaker

DELETED

falckoner's picture
falckoner

I usually stick with whole-wheat breads, but my husband much prefers white bread for his sandwiches, so I decided I'd finally indulge him. I decided to try this recipe because it uses a poolish and not-too-much kneading. The first time I made it, my husband called it "the perfect bread." It stayed fresh very well, and we made sandwiches from it all week.

I don't know where to find ascorbic acid, so I make it without, and it works fine. Flavor, color, and texture are all spot-on. I've been thinking about doubling it and freezing one loaf so I only have to bake half as often. Do you think I should make any adjustments when I do? Could you tell me more about what you do to make it with less yeast and a longer bulk fermentation?

Syd's picture
Syd

Falckoner,

Apolgies for not replying sooner, but somehow your response slipped my attention.  I haven't been on these boards much in the past few months, either.

 

I don't always use ascorbic acid if I don't have it on hand.  It will be fine without.  

I don't think you would need to make any adjustments if you double the recipe.  If the weather were very warm, you could cut down on the yeast a little (say use 5g instead of 6g for two loaves), but the rest of the measurements should be spot on.  

 

If you exclude the poolish the amount of yeast in the main dough is only 1% of the weight of the flour.  That is a fairly small amount but probably quite normal for a loaf like this.  Certainly, if you wanted to lengthen the bulk fermentation you could drop it to .6% (1.8g) if you have a scale that can measure that accurately.  You could also bulk ferment in the fridge, or a method which I prefer, after bulk fermentation shape and place in loaf tins.  Now cover loosely in very lightly oiled plastic wrap (this will prevent it from sticking to your loaf and making unsightly rips), put the whole thing in a big plastic bag and put in it the fridge to rise.  When you remove it for baking, if it hasn't fully proofed, allow it to prove a bit more at room temp before baking.  

 

Hope this answers you questions.  All the best,

Syd

AsherMaximum's picture
AsherMaximum

I've made this quite a few times now, and I love it. It is my first bread that didn't turn out too dense. 

I've been adding about 1 tbs of honey, and it turns out great that way. I've also left the steam in the whole time once to see what it would do to the crust. It makes a softer crust that way, which I like sometimes. I've been scoring the loaf down the middle or with diagonal slashes which makes it look really nice.

The one issue I have is that with a 12 hour poolish, I have to make it the night before and the make the rest of the recipe in the morning, which makes it impossible to do during the week due to work (9-5). I was wondering if it was possible to retard the poolish in the fridge so that I could leave it for 18-20 hours instead of 12? I thought that might not be long enough in the fridge, so I thought maybe I should start it at room temp, and then move to the fridge, but I'm not sure how long I should leave it out before putting it in the fridge. Any suggestions for times?

Syd's picture
Syd

Asher,

Yes, you can retard the poolish.  I have seen recipes which call for it.  I haven't done it myself, though.  I usually use just enough yeast to get the job done in twelve hours.  That means a little more in winter and a little less in summer.  Most times it just entails sticking the top third of  a steak knife into the instant yeast jar and using the granules that cling to it (which are not a lot).  However, that is because the weather here in the south of Taiwan is very warm (even in winter it doesn't go much below 26C except when we have a cold front and those are few and far between).  

If I were going to retard, I would definitely wait until I saw some yeast activity in the poolish before refrigerating it.  I would probably wait 4 - 6 hours, but you might have to experiment.

best,

Syd