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ianb's picture

Please help to improve a recipe for morning rolls

October 24, 2010 - 4:35am -- ianb
Forums: 

Hi, I hope someone more knowledgeable can advise me. I'm trying to make the soft white rolls that I can buy in Scotland (nothing better for a bacon sandwich). The recipe I use is

200ml water

50ml milk

300g plain white flour

150g strong white flour

25g butter

tsp sugar

tsp salt

sachet of dried yeast

Mix, let rise an hour, knock back, shape into rolls, let rise another hour, bake at 180C for 20 mins or so.

 

GSnyde's picture
GSnyde

 

Or maybe World Series Sourdough?!! [Go, Giants!!]

I have enjoyed Acme Bread’s Pain de Campagne a couple times recently.  It’s a moderately sour boule with a thin toothsome crust and a somewhat fluffy, but chewy crumb.  I think it has some whole rye flour and some whole wheat flour.  It's about my favorite bread ever.

So, today I tried to bake something like it.  I used the formula and procedure for Hamelman’s Vermont Sourdough as a starting point, but used KA European Style flour and some KA whole wheat flour and used a longer bulk ferment.

I studied dmsnyder’s boule-shaping tutorial and did my best to follow his tutelage and was very pleased with my shaping effort.  I got good oven spring and a nice crust crackles.  The crumb is just what I was  going for--light but chewy.  And the flavor is also pretty close to the Acme Pain de Campagne—nutty and complex and just a little sour.  I think this is the best tasting Sourdough I’ve made.

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Here’s the formula:

San Francisco Country Sourdough 

Yield: Two 1.5 lb Loaves

Ingredients

LIQUID-LEVAIN BUILD

100 grams   AP flour

24 grams  Whole Wheat flour

12 grams  Whole rye flour

170 grams   Water, luke warm

28  grams   Mature culture (75% hydration)

 

FINAL DOUGH (66% hydration, including levain)

680 grams   KAF European-Style Artisan Bread flour (88%)

45 grams  Whole wheat flour (6%)

45 grams   Whole rye flour (6%)

425 grams   Water at room temperature (55%)

17 grams   Salt (2%)

306     Liquid levain  (40%)

   

Directions

1. LIQUID LEVAIN:  Make the final build 12 to 16 hours before the final mix, and let stand in a covered container at room temperature (about 70 F).

2. MIXING: Add all the ingredients to the mixing bowl, including the levain, but not the salt. Mix just until the ingredients are incorporated into a shaggy mass. Correct the hydration as necessary.  Cover the bowl with plastic and let autolyse for 30 to 60 minutes. At the end of the autolyse, sprinkle the salt over the surface of the dough, and finish mixing 5-7 minutes. 

3. BULK FERMENTATION WITH S&F:  3 hours. Stretch and fold the dough in the bowl twice 30-strokes at 45-minute intervals.  Place dough ball in lightly oiled bowl, and stretch and fold on lightly floured board at 45 minutes.

4. RETARDED BULK FERMENTATION (optional):   After second s&F on board, form dough into ball and then place again in lightly oiled bowl.  Refrigerate 8-20 hours, depending on sourness desired and scheduling convenience. [I skipped this step this time].

5. DIVIDING AND SHAPING: Divide the dough into two  pieces and pre-shape.  Let sit on board for 30 minutes, and then shape into boules or batards.

6. PROOFING: Approximately 2 to 2 1/2 hours at room temperature (about 70° F).  Ready when poke test dictates.  Pre-heat oven to 500 F with steam apparatus in place. 

7. BAKING: With steam, on stone.  Turn oven to 460 °F after steaming.  Remove steaming apparatus after 12 minutes. Bake for 35 to 40 minutes to

tal.   Rotate loaves for evenness as necessary.  When done (205 F internal temp), leave loaves on stone with oven door ajar 10 minutes.




I recommend this bread to anyone who likes sourdough with a moderate amount of whole grain.


Glenn

 

Ryan Sandler's picture
Ryan Sandler

The adventure continues!

In this weeks edition of Hamelman's Baguette's with Poolish, I made three modifications to the process from last week (well, more like two and a half:

  • Reduced the yeast in the poolish.  I've been preparing a half batch of dough relative to Hamelman's "Home" proportions, but until now I haven't reduced the yeast in the poolish,  which sounds quite foolish until you realize that the yeast measurement is 1/8 tsp, and nearly every yeasted preferment in the book calls for 1/8 tsp of yeast, regardless of size.  Anyway, I've been feeling like there's a degree of flavor and texture missing, as well as the presence of a pronounced alcohol smell about the poolish (and then the finished dough to some extent).  So I approximated a 1/16 tsp of yeast in 5.3 oz. each of flour and water.  
  • Tried to handle the dough more gently during shaping and preshaping. 
  • Last week I forgot to turn the oven down after loading the baguettes, so this week I made sure not to do that!

 

After 11 hours the poolish was bubbly and had a pungent aroma with just a hint of maybe some alcohol in the background.  It's possible I could have fermented it even less with no ill effects.  One of these weeks, I may try making three tiny batches of dough with three tiny batches of poolish, and test just what results I get from different amounts of time and yeast.

The Results: Crust

 

Crumb:


I was pretty happy with this batch.  Definitely better than before, although clearly not there yet.  I'm not sure if it's clear from the picture, but the crust was definitely a darker color than previous batches, with the same amount of baking time.  This lends some credence to my notion that the poolish was overfermenting somewhat before (or so I understood it from Larry last week--I'm happy to stand corrected on this!).  My slashing is getting more consistent, although unfortunately the scores are consistently too close together as well! Believe it or not, the one in the middle actually had four discrete slashes before it went into the oven...

Crumb was definitely better than last week, although not quite up to where I want it to be.  Texture-wise, also a bit less fluffy and more creamy than before, but still somewhat fluffy.  Flavor was also better--I'm finally starting to get some of the nice nutty notes that I remember from my lucky breaks with this dough.  Just some of them, however.  Crust was thin and crisp on top, but thick and chewy on the bottom--I think you can even see it in the picture.  Not sure what that's all about--possibly a result of leaving the baguettes in to crisp a little more with the oven turned off?

Next week: Further reduction of the yeast in the poolish -- worst case scenario it isn't ready to go when I want to start mixing at 9am, and I start the bread a little later, right?  Also, time to start experimenting with steaming methods.  I'm really intrigued by the steaming method SylviaH posted earlier this week. I would have tried it today, but I didn't want to conflate the results of not goofing up the oven temperature with the effects of the steaming method.

As always, any tips, comments, or smart remarks are welcome and appreciated,

-Ryan

dmsnyder's picture
dmsnyder

Traditional baguette, Dragon tail and Épi de Blé (left to right)

These baguettes were made with my San Joaquin Sourdough dough. I shaped a traditional baguette, an épi de blé (sheaf of wheat) and a dragon tail. Each was scaled to 248 g. They were baked with steam for 10 minutes at 460ºF conventional bake and in a dry oven for 10 minutes at 435ºF convection bake. My formula for San Joaquin Sourdough is available here: San Joaquin Sourdough, updated However, for those attempting these shapes for the first time, I recommend using a lower hydration dough such as Pat's (proth5). That formula can be found here: Baguette crumb - 65% hydration dough

Instructions for making an épi

1. Shape a baguette and proof it.

2. Transfer a baguette to your peel.

3. Starting at the left end (if you are right handed) or at the far end, if the baguette is oriented perpendicular to your body, make evenly spaced cuts along the baguette with a sharp scissors. The scissors should cut at about a 45º angle, almost but not completely through the loaf. With each cut, the cut part is rotated away from the long axis of the loaf, alternating right and left.

4. Load the épi onto your baking stone and bake as you would a regular baguette.

Instructions for making a dragon tail baguette

The dragon tail is made in the same way as the épi, except, rather than rotating the cut pieces, the tip of each is folded back over the body, away from the cut surface. Here is a photograph of Miyuki Togi, my SFBI instructor, forming a dragon tail:

SusanFNP has made an instructional video for shaping a Dragon Tail baguette which is highly recommended. Dragon Tail Baguette Shaping Video

Dragon tail, close-up 1

Dragon tail, close-up 2

Enjoy!

David

Submitted to YeastSpotting

Frequent Flyer's picture

Swirled Whole Wheat Loaves

October 23, 2010 - 3:18pm -- Frequent Flyer
Forums: 

I'm working on a two-tone wheat loaf using Reinhart's Whole Grain Breads "100% Whole Wheat Sandwich Bread".  This was 2 recipes using King Arthur's whole wheat flour (and some cocoa powder for color) and white whole wheat flour. I divided each dough into 2 pieces and layered the white whole wheat and whole wheat doughs after rolling them out.  It's still a work in progress.

 

blamejane's picture

I ran out of bagels

October 23, 2010 - 1:35pm -- blamejane
Forums: 

I made a batch-and-a-half of bagels and they're already gone! It's not time to fire up the brick oven as I still have several ciabatta and french baguettes in the freezer. So in the mean time I'm gonna make a batch of bagels using my home oven. This will be the first time I've used this oven for any type of bread. I'm not worried about it though cuz this recipe calls for the bagels to be baked on a baking sheet at a temperature of 450 degrees.

All I can think about is those freakin' salt bagel...Mmmm.

louie brown's picture
louie brown

Not happy with the commercially yeasted version I had been making for the holidays, I decided to try this one. It is just excellent. The crumb is creamy, with just enough tooth. The taste is rich, with that wonderful underlayer of complex sourdough flavor, not at all sour in this case.

 

I was inspired and guided by zolablue's post on the subject, as well as Maggie Glezer's video. Thanks so much to both.

 

 

 

Vogel's picture
Vogel

Since I've never really been satisfied with my Ciabatta, I tried to do it in a more conservative way. I only used a 75% hydration dough, so the lower end of the Ciabatta range. Instead of doing the stretch & fold directly in the bowl with wet hands, I did it on the floured work surface, which took a little more time. I carefully followed the principle of the dough having an axis with two poles (the smooth side and the sticky side). The result was a dough that was so strong that I couldn't even really stretch it in order to cut out the pieces. In the oven the loaves expanded so much that part of the crust opened.

I didn't watch the baking process well enough in the end phase, so the crust burnt a little and the bread dried out a little around the outer layers of the crumb. The crumb wasn't extremely open. Still I am really happy about how they came out and how strong the dough was.

Ciabatta crust

Ciabatta crumb

livingdog's picture
livingdog

I have discovered why my breads were bland - I WASN'T BAKING THEM! That sounds silly, but I am a newbie and my understanding was - put it in the hot oven, bake for X minutes and then take out. WRONG NEWBIE BREATH! (LOL! I miss Johnny Carson.)

The idea I was missing was that I am baking a cake - that requires two parts:

  1. bake at required temperature for the crust to form, and
  2. bake at second required temperature FOR THE INSIDE OF THE BREAD!

So now my breads have turned out better tasting - not astounding amazing phenomenal - as when a professional does it - but better.

Onward through the fog.

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