The Fresh Loaf

News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts
freckled's picture

is it too late to add vinegar to make buttermilk????

April 17, 2010 - 6:12pm -- freckled

so i'm making whole wheat honey bread with a biga and soaker.  usually, i like to use buttermilk, but only have whole milk right now and used it for the soaker.  but checking on the internet, saw i could "sour" the milk to make "buttermilk" by putting in 1TBSP per cup of milk and WAITING 5 mins to sour. dang it, why didn't i check before adding the milk????

oskar270's picture

1st Sourdough, No Success

April 17, 2010 - 5:50pm -- oskar270

Into my 1st sourdough and have no success, wonder what I did wrong

I copy this recipe, Norwich Sourdough, from this forum and I'm using half the recipe (all quantities divided by half). My starter is 6 days old and has double in volume with a frothy top and very nice sour smell.

The dough from step 3 onwards was very liquid, like a Jell-O, and very sticky. I'm at step 9 now and the dough after 2.5 hours has not risen at all. Ambient temp. in kitchen is about 72 F. I will keep it another hour and if nothing happens, well I have to scrap it.

dmsnyder's picture

A few days ago, DonD blogged about some gorgeous baguettes he baked using a combination of unconventional mixing and fermentation techniques adapted from formulas developed by Pierre Gosselin and Anis Bouabsa, both very highly regarded Parisian boulangers. His description can be found here: Baguettes a l'Ancienne with Cold Retardation

Don used both the long autolyse under refrigeration of Gosselin and the cold retarded bulk fermentation of the complete dough employed by Bouabsa. He got such wonderful results, I had to try his hybrid technique.

I had been concerned that the double cold retardation would result in a dough that had so much proteolysis as to be unmanageable. However, Don described his dough as "silky smooth." Well, my dough was sticky slack. It was all extensibility and no elasticity. Fortunately, i have worked often enough with doughs like this to know they can make the most wonderful breads, so I shaped (best I could), proofed, slashed and baked. Voilà!


Since I was already afraid I'd over-fermented the dough, I erred on the side of under-proofing. The baguettes had almost explosive oven-spring. They about doubled in volume during the bake.

The crust was crunchy. The crumb was .... Oh, my!

The flavor was very good, but not as sweet as I recall the "pure" Gosselin Pain à l'Anciènne being.

These baguettes are worth baking again with some adjustments. I would endorse Don's decrease in the amount of yeast. I'll do so next time. And I will try a slightly lower hydration level. These were 73% hydration.

Thanks, Don, for sharing this very interesting twist in baguette techniques.


saltandserenity's picture

Woman can not live by bread alone.

April 17, 2010 - 1:19pm -- saltandserenity

I am participating in the bread Baker's Apprentice Challenge.  (BBAC) While I have baked 36 of the 43 breads to date, I got a little side tracked by some amazing Peanut Butter Caramel Swirl Brownies!

008cats's picture

Salt % reduction - pros? cons?

April 17, 2010 - 12:01pm -- 008cats

I just realized the other day that a recipe I was fine-tuning to my liking was actually too salty for my taste (the sourness had masked this quite a bit). I reduced it from 2% TFW to 1.65% and felt the taste was better - I could go lower as we don't use much salt and I find I can taste it much more than other folk. The thing is, and I've done this twice now just to make sure, the dough was so much easier to handle & shape (which is great), but the crumb was much softer and less chewy (about  which I feel less enthusiastic).

Lorna's picture

How about an understandable recipe for "Japanese Style White Sandwich Breadread"  I have no idea how to convert quickly. The bread looks wonderful.


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